Understanding Fish Oil Labels

[QUIKAZHELL]

Why does this seem so difficult. We all know of the numerous benefits of taking anywhere from 5-10 grams of fish oil per day but why does the label seem to make it so complicated.

First you have Flameout by Biotest which seems to be pretty potent stuff.

Biotest Flameout
1 serving = 4 softgels
Total Fat = 5.6g
Total Free Fatty Acids= 4625 mg
DHA= 2200 mg
EPA= 880 mg

2200 mg + 880 mg = 3080 mg So where does this 4625 mg number come from and how about the 5.6 g. Why didn’t they just list the 5.6 as 5,600 mg to be consistent?

From what I understand if your goal is to get 10 grams of fish oil per day then taking for sake of simplicty 8 of these per day would get you near what you want but would that be 11.2 grams or would it be 9.25 grams?

Then you have the vitamin shoppe liquid brand which I just picked up.

VS Liquid Fish Oil
1 serving = 1 teaspoon
Total Fat = 4.5g
Total Free Fatty Acids= 1250 mg
DHA= 410 mg
EPA= 650 mg

Again 410 + 650 = 1060 so where the hell does the 1250 mg come from and how about the 4.5g? And how is the total fat content of this product not much off the biotest flameout but yet the total free fatty acids is much lower as is the DHA EPA.

Is our goal number of 10 grams just based on Total Free Fatty acids? So 8 teaspoons per day for the vitamin shoppe brand would come close to 8 flameout caps in terms of dosage.

8 Flameout caps
Total Free Fatty Acids= 10 grams
DHA= 3280
EPA= 2880

8 Teaspoons of Vitamin Shoppe Liquid
Total Free Fatty Acids= 9,250 mg
DHA= 4400
EPA= 1760

Taking things a step further this would mean a bottle of Flameout would last 11 days (taking 8 caps per day with 90 caps in a bottle) and the vitamin shoppe liquid would last 5 days (taking 8 teaspoons per day with 47 teaspoons in a bottle).

Regarding price … bottle of flameout 30$ for 11 days = 90$ month
bottle of VS Liquid 10$ for 5 days = 60$ month

Gotta be effin kidding me unless I’m super confused.
And how great. I been posting here for over 6 years and perhaps my longest post is deciphering the label of the fish oil bottle.

[lylemcd]

I think you’re confusion is coming from the following. Usually when people say 10 grams of fish oils per day, they mean 10X1 gram capsules where each capsule typically contains 300mg of active fish oil. So at most you’re getting 3 actual grams of active fish oil.

You do’nt need 10 grams of active ingredient.

So with the flameout product, you’d only take 4 capsules per day which would provide 3 grams of active fish oil (2200 mg DHA + 800 mg EPA = 3000 mg = 3 grams total fish oil).

Since there are nearly 1100mg actie fish oil in teh Vitamin World product, you’d only need 3 tsp per day to get ~3300mg = 3.3 grams active fish oil.

Hope that makes sense
Lyle

[raffiki]

Using the first example:
You have 3080mg of omega 3.
Then you have 4625mg of omega 3, 6, and 9.
Then you have 5.6mg of total fat, which is not all free fatty acids.

The vitamin shoppe looks like they have likely added another oil to it.

[QUIKAZHELL]

@lylemcd

I think you’re confusion is coming from the following. Usually when people say 10 grams of fish oils per day, they mean 10X1 gram capsules where each capsule typically contains 300mg of active fish oil. So at most you’re getting 3 actual grams of active fish oil.

You do’nt need 10 grams of active ingredient.

So with the flameout product, you’d only take 4 capsules per day which would provide 3 grams of active fish oil (2200 mg DHA + 800 mg EPA = 3000 mg = 3 grams total fish oil).

Since there are nearly 1100mg actie fish oil in teh Vitamin World product, you’d only need 3 tsp per day to get ~3300mg = 3.3 grams active fish oil.

Hope that makes sense
Lyle

If that is in fact true then yes it makes sense. Just wondering why people insist on making recomendation of 10g per day. So everyone is making the error of assuming ALL fish oil caps are created equal in assuming they are 1g each? So how many grams a day of fish oil should we be shooting for as athletes?

[Chris6878]

I use this one http://www.1fast400.com/?products_id=1514
Supplement Facts:
Serving Size: 1 Soft Gel
Servings Per Container: 60
Amount Per Serving: 1350 mg
Amount Per Serving
Calories 12
Calories from Fat 12
Total Fat 1.35 g
Saturated Fat 27mg
Monounsaturated Fat 189mg
Polyunaturated Fat 1.1g
Cholesterol 3mg 0%
Highly Concentrated Nordic Fish Oil 1350 mg
(43% EPA - eicosapentaenoic acid 20:5, N-3, 580.5mg)
(22% DHA - docosahexaenoic acid 22:6, N-3, 297mg)
(25% mixed fatty acids, 337.5mg)
(2% stearidonic, 18:4, N-3 27mg)
Total Omega-3 Fatty Acids 1012.5 mg - this line isn’t on the bottle
Mixed Tocopherols (Vitamin E) 1.35IU

[lylemcd]

@QUIKAZHELL

If that is in fact true then yes it makes sense. Just wondering why people insist on making recomendation of 10g per day. So everyone is making the error of assuming ALL fish oil caps are created equal in assuming they are 1g each? So how many grams a day of fish oil should we be shooting for as athletes?

I tend to assume fairly standard dosing as mos fish oils are about the same (180 mg epa/120 mg DHA or I may have those reversed). So total active fish oil is 3 grams/day.

Of course, if your fish oils ar higher concentrated (e.g. some of the pharmaceutical brands are like 360 mg epa/240 DHA so you only need half as many), you won’t need as many. So it’s probably better to talk in term of active fish oil (total epa/dha) to avoid confusion.

There is data that that level will saturate a variety of different tissues so I don’t see much need to take more than that, even as an athlete.

Lyle

[QUIKAZHELL]

@lylemcd

I tend to assume fairly standard dosing as mos fish oils are about the same (180 mg epa/120 mg DHA or I may have those reversed). So total active fish oil is 3 grams/day.

Of course, if your fish oils ar higher concentrated (e.g. some of the pharmaceutical brands are like 360 mg epa/240 DHA so you only need half as many), you won’t need as many. So it’s probably better to talk in term of active fish oil (total epa/dha) to avoid confusion.

There is data that that level will saturate a variety of different tissues so I don’t see much need to take more than that, even as an athlete.

Lyle

Lyle-
You are correct regarding standard dosing however if we are talking in terms of EPA/DHA 180mg + 120 mg = .3 of a gram not 3 grams. So to get 3 grams we are looking at taking 10 of them. Reguarding reccomendations from what I have read and others I have spoken to I still see around 10 grams for athletes. For this to make sense and without draining your bank account it seems that this could be made possible by going with “trueproteins” product which is the same amount per capsule as we both said 180+120=.3 and taking 30 of them per day which would equal 10 grams. They sell 1000 for 24$ which would basically last 1 month. So 24$ for 10 grams of fish oil per day would be 24$a month.

[QUIKAZHELL]

@Chris6878

I use this one http://www.1fast400.com/?products_id=1514
Supplement Facts:
Serving Size: 1 Soft Gel
Servings Per Container: 60
Amount Per Serving: 1350 mg
Amount Per Serving
Calories 12
Calories from Fat 12
Total Fat 1.35 g
Saturated Fat 27mg
Monounsaturated Fat 189mg
Polyunaturated Fat 1.1g
Cholesterol 3mg 0%
Highly Concentrated Nordic Fish Oil 1350 mg
(43% EPA - eicosapentaenoic acid 20:5, N-3, 580.5mg)
(22% DHA - docosahexaenoic acid 22:6, N-3, 297mg)
(25% mixed fatty acids, 337.5mg)
(2% stearidonic, 18:4, N-3 27mg)
Total Omega-3 Fatty Acids 1012.5 mg - this line isn’t on the bottle
Mixed Tocopherols (Vitamin E) 1.35IU

Yea so to get 10 grams a day you need to take about 8-10 of these. These are pretty potent but at 18 bucks a bottle its only lasting a week (actually 6 days) which is 72$+ per month compared to 24$.

[RB34]

@QUIKAZHELL

Lyle-
You are correct regarding standard dosing however if we are talking in terms of EPA/DHA 180mg + 120 mg = .3 of a gram not 3 grams. So to get 3 grams we are looking at taking 10 of them. Reguarding reccomendations from what I have read and others I have spoken to I still see around 10 grams for athletes. For this to make sense and without draining your bank account it seems that this could be made possible by going with “trueproteins” product which is the same amount per capsule as we both said 180+120=.3 and taking 30 of them per day which would equal 10 grams. They sell 1000 for 24$ which would basically last 1 month. So 24$ for 10 grams of fish oil per day would be 24$a month.

Wow, 30 pills per day…

[AngelaCoon]

check out Omega Brite. It’s a product I love.

[boldwarrior]

Herbalife’s bottles last 1month at very slightly under 3g active a day

[mortac8]

Quik,

I would just go with 10 1g caps daily of the el-cheapo version (truprotein or costco/walmart or…). I have tried probably 5-10 brands over the years including the fancy expensive brands, flameout, and the 400cap for $10 brands and notice no difference. Or you could ask Poliquin and he might tell you to take 45 caps daily of some medical grade oil at a cost of $500/month.

[QUIKAZHELL]

@mortac8

Quik,

I would just go with 10 1g caps daily of the el-cheapo version (truprotein or costco/walmart or…). I have tried probably 5-10 brands over the years including the fancy expensive brands, flameout, and the 400cap for $10 brands and notice no difference. Or you could ask Poliquin and he might tell you to take 45 caps daily of some medical grade oil at a cost of $500/month.

Perhaps you haven;t taken enough for long enough.
Anyway this seems to make the most sense…

Mike Roussell (T-Nation)

2. I hate it when people give fish oil recommendations and talk in terms of capsules or grams of fish oil. Talk in terms of EPA and DHA! Otherwise it just confuses people! There is no standard concentration of fish oil so saying that you take 3 one gram capsules means crap. EPA and DHA is what matters.

Charles didn’t specify EPA/DHA and if you go to his website and look at the liquid fish oil he sells you can’t see the nutritional facts to see how pure it is. I would assume (it is a pretty safe assumption) that Charles’ fish oil is 30% pure and thus 45 grams of fish oil is only 13.5g EPA/DHA. Thus he is recommending 9-13.5 grams of EPA/DHA. This isn’t that outrageous in that studies have found that 25-30g EPA/DHA is well tolerated without adverse bleeding effets. But as Canadian_Bacon has pointed out “results may vary”. I wouldn’t recommend that you follow Charles’ recommendations using a 30% pure fish oil supplement as your exposure to potential toxins will be greatly increased. But if you choose a higher purity/potency product, increase you dosages in a stepwise manner over time, and spread your intake out across the day (I wouldn’t consume more than 5 grams at a time) I’m sure you would see a benefit…to what extent I’m not sure because the most I’ve ever consumed was 7 grams EPa/DHA per day…

[mortac8]

@QUIKAZHELL

Perhaps you haven;t taken enough for long enough.
Anyway this seems to make the most sense…

Perhaps. I have taken about 5g EPA 3g DHA in the past as my higher end doses (for months on end continuously). Currently I am taking like 2.5g EPA 1.5g DHA. Either way I notice no difference.

Do you need to mega-dose it? Will you be in trouble if EPA is higher than DHA? Will Muscle Milk kill you? Maybe to all but somehow I doubt it. I noticed no difference with any of the above compared with Flameout, Spring Valley(walmart), NOW, Carlsons, Carl Valle brand, OmegaBrite, etc. If you are worried about inflammation I would look at a less acidic diet (no fun) before I would spend the house on fish oils.

[QUIKAZHELL]

@mortac8

Perhaps. I have taken about 5g EPA 3g DHA in the past as my higher end doses (for months on end continuously). Currently I am taking like 2.5g EPA 1.5g DHA. Either way I notice no difference.

Do you need to mega-dose it? Will you be in trouble if EPA is higher than DHA? Will Muscle Milk kill you? Maybe to all but somehow I doubt it. I noticed no difference with any of the above compared with Flameout, Spring Valley(walmart), NOW, Carlsons, Carl Valle brand, OmegaBrite, etc. If you are worried about inflammation I would look at a less acidic diet (no fun) before I would spend the house on fish oils.

Thanks for the info. on your past experience.
I will be mega dosing it primarily to relieve joint/muscle pain/tightness as well as sleep. Regarding spending the house on it …24$ a month (1000 caps) would only cause a bum to lose his box. I think my 2 bedroom apartment is safe:cool:

[lylemcd]

@QUIKAZHELL

Lyle-
You are correct regarding standard dosing however if we are talking in terms of EPA/DHA 180mg + 120 mg = .3 of a gram not 3 grams.

10 standard capsules = 10 * 0.3 g/capsule = 3 grams active.

So to get 3 grams we are looking at taking 10 of them. Reguarding reccomendations from what I have read and others I have spoken to I still see around 10 grams for athletes.

I’ve seen a lot of things. Never seen an iota of research to back it. As noted, many tissues saturated at around 3 g/day. What good is more doing in that situation?

In my opinion, absolutely nothing.

Lyle

[lylemcd]

@QUIKAZHELL

Perhaps you haven;t taken enough for long enough.
Anyway this seems to make the most sense…

Mike Roussell (T-Nation)

2. I hate it when people give fish oil recommendations and talk in terms of capsules or grams of fish oil. Talk in terms of EPA and DHA! Otherwise it just confuses people! There is no standard concentration of fish oil so saying that you take 3 one gram capsules means crap. EPA and DHA is what matters.

Charles didn’t specify EPA/DHA and if you go to his website and look at the liquid fish oil he sells you can’t see the nutritional facts to see how pure it is. I would assume (it is a pretty safe assumption) that Charles’ fish oil is 30% pure and thus 45 grams of fish oil is only 13.5g EPA/DHA. Thus he is recommending 9-13.5 grams of EPA/DHA. This isn’t that outrageous in that studies have found that 25-30g EPA/DHA is well tolerated without adverse bleeding effets.

Well tolerated and beneficial don’t mean the same thing.

Lyle

[QUIKAZHELL]

@lylemcd

Well tolerated and beneficial don’t mean the same thing.

Lyle

Ok. So TYPICALLY for an athlete you would suggest 3 grams total of EPH/DHA and with standard fish oil caps (180/120) its 10 caps per day. The other reccomendations we are “hearing” are up to 3x that which would give us 9g EPA/DHA and 30 grams total which is why we are hearing reccomendations as high as that.

[QUIKAZHELL]

Appears as though taking 3 tablespoons of the vitamin shoppe liquid I originally posted willl give the equivalent of taking 30 standard 180/120 epha/dha caps. Also at 10$ a bottle which would last 15 days (and buy one get one have quite often) 15$ a month on fish oil is rather reasonable.

[Chris6878]

@QUIKAZHELL

Appears as though taking 3 tablespoons of the vitamin shoppe liquid I originally posted willl give the equivalent of taking 30 standard 180/120 epha/dha caps. Also at 10$ a bottle which would last 15 days (and buy one get one have quite often) 15$ a month on fish oil is rather reasonable.

How does it taste?