I have just read Micheal Johnsons book, and reading his scheadules it seemes that he train hard mon-wed (3h)every week and then 3 days easier(1h).
This is apperently the opposite to the CFTS, his recovery are also very low about 3-8 min.
What about 48 hours rest from heavy seassions?
MJ did some amazing stoff…he must have done something right…what do you guys think? :mrt:
“There’s more than one way to skin a cat” :shoot:
True,
I never heard of anyone benching 7 days a week until a few months ago with JS and AA …
I guess it’s another way to try and tinker and optimise the benefits of supercompensation
Please break down and quanitfy the differences…
Right CFTS, Left MJ Training
Remember that Mike was a 200m/400m guy so he spent more time with SP E.
Good Topic!
Sample CFTS 400m Training Week (pre-Competition phase)
Day 1: Speed + Weights
Day 2: Tempo
Day 3: SE1 (e.g. 2 x 300m) + Weights
Day 4: Tempo
Day 5: Speed
Day 6: SE2 (e.g. 2 x 600m) + Weights
Day 7: Rest + Visit the In-Laws!
Mohikan- can you fill out a comparitive training week to this using MJ’s program.
Some of these things could also be a little misleading …
It could have been purely down to logistics.
… if I remember from the book correctly - the reason for the 3 days hard and 3 days easy were because he was travelling alot from the Uni track and CH to home - isnt that correct?
Yeah I thought he trained with Coach Hart at the uni during the week and went home on the weekend.
Interesting question. Also alot of the programs in the book are towards the end of his training year getting for the games, so that might also not be a true indication of his training.
unfortunately I havent had the privelege to read his book but I would like to know what his philosophy was around the shorter rest periods. I think you mentioned 3-8 minutes. could you please elaborate.
Yes the reason was because of traveling to Waco, Texas I belive.
But the fact still remains the same, MJ didn`t seem to take graet notice of having cns-stress days a row.
If I remember right, ( I could get back more specific when I got the book infront of me)
Mon. 5-6x200m 26-27sec rest 90sec tempo?
Tue. 2x485m sec? rest 7½ min
Wed. 3x385m sec? rest 3 min +3x40m
Thur. starts 10m?
Fri . 2x60,70,70,90 4x40m
this day was called speedmakers
I don`t remember more but I think this was the program. I will get back with the exact program if you are interested…
But in general it seems that the big diffirens to CFTS are not using 48h recoverys from high stress and not full recovery between races.
Weight training is not described in the book…
I like the side-by-side post idea. Are the concepts really different- or is it a matter of interpretation? As an example, how much CNS stress is there with 10m starts? How fast are the runs over 485 etc?
Originally posted by mohikan
I have just read Micheal Johnsons book, and reading his scheadules it seemes that he train hard mon-wed (3h)every week and then 3 days easier(1h)…… MJ did some amazing stoff…he must have done something right…what do you guys think? :mrt:
I don’t know if you have looked at the prior discussions here on MJ. The following may be helpful in assessing his activities or the intent of Clyde Hart during his golden years!
http://www.charliefrancis.com/board/philboard_read.asp?id=913&recordnum=40
Originally posted by shabachsports
unfortunately I havent had the privelege to read his book but I would like to know what his philosophy was around the shorter rest periods. I think you mentioned 3-8 minutes. could you please elaborate.
i believe there is a theory that if you rest any longer than 3-8 minutes your body automatically starts cooling down if you don’t keep moving. could anyone verify or disprove that?
Recovery times.
Lactic levels tend to peak at around 3min after an effort. The 385 (350m+10%) are also designed to maximize lactic production (Clyde has said before that it takes 40sec to build up lactic and a continued effort after is needed to get the most out of it). So perfoming the 385m (with a 350m split around 43seconds) with 3min recoveries will, in theory, maximize lactic build up.
This work hits the nervous system hard - but in a very different way that speed or accelleration would. High levels of lactate in the blood and muscles have large negative effects on the ability to send electro chemical signals through the nerves, particularly at the myneural junction.
It’s worthwhile noting that times in his journal are splits - not outright times.
Times are also his inseason regimen - not training phase.
There is NO special endurance. Only lactate and speed endurance.
Originally posted by Charlie Francis
I like the side-by-side post idea. Are the concepts really different- or is it a matter of interpretation? As an example, how much CNS stress is there with 10m starts? How fast are the runs over 485 etc?
Distance is actually 495. First 400m is run in :. 50seconds.
Here’s a short excerpt from the diary in the book:
Week of May 6 1996
Mon 6x200m 26[sec] 90[sec rec.]
6x40m
Tues 2x495 50/50 7 1/2
6x40m
Wed Starts 10m 5
Speedmakers (3sets 60,70,80)
Thurs 3x385 25/44 3
4x40m
Fri Starts
6x100m 10.15(?)
Sat 3x275 29/28/27 2
Week of May 15
Mon 5x200m 25 90
Tues 2x385 24/40, 24/41 3
Wed Speed Makers - 2 sets 60,60,70,70 (5) 60,70,80,90
Thurs Warm up
Sat ATL GP 19.83
Week May 20
Mon 6x200m 26 90
Tues 1x495 50 10min
2x330 28/40
Wed 3x385 24/40 3
Thur Speed Makers (3sets) 60,60,70,70
Fri 10x100 10(?)
Sat Starts 3x30m, 40,50,60
Dazed
Thanks for the good “Real Deal” type info 
First off: Michael cannot be wrong- by definition. I think there is a division between high and low- though most is high.
Note how the speed and stress goes up from very easy for the first day after the 19.83 200m race, and how much time he spends out around 40sec in his runs, something Clyde Hart and John Smith stress.
It might be worth looking at some upper limit tempo times by my interpretation (I’ve always gone with 75% for safety but my understanding is that 80% is the likely max with this type of work-- SO…
PB 19.32 (19.1ht) 75%=25.5 80%=23.9
PB in the 400m must be adjusted to reflect MJs real ability- not his WR- as he got injured in 1996 before he could put it into the ozone with the 200m- so a realistic PB would be obtained by 2 x 200 + 3.5sec = 41.7ht!!!
Now PB 41.7 75%= 55.6 80% = 52.1
Work across the board on all his training bests and you get a better idea of what’s really going on.
Look at the quality of his speed work- the part that counts-
3 x 275 as fast as 27.2. Think about that for a minute!l
385 in 44 would equal 45.7 in the 400m, or approx 92%.
Does anyone know if the intervals are from a standing start or a run-in? And, if so, which is which?
What’s even more amazing is that although these are his “in season” workouts, he is able to accomplish a high volume of intense workouts with little recovery -av. 3min per rep :o
I would very much like to see his pre-comp workout; his base has got to be phenomenal :shoot:
I was about to put in the pages from MJ´s diary, but Dazed did some good work with the facts.
I to was quite amazed that this pages are from during competitionperiods.
The pages are fotos of MJ´s real diary, so some numbers are not always 100%
understandble, but most of it is.
His recovery must have been from another planet…
Originally posted by Charlie Francis
First off: Michael cannot be wrong- by definition. I think there is a division between high and low- though most is high.
Note how the speed and stress goes up from very easy for the first day after the 19.83 200m race, and how much time he spends out around 40sec in his runs, something Clyde Hart and John Smith stress.
It might be worth looking at some upper limit tempo times by my interpretation (I’ve always gone with 75% for safety but my understanding is that 80% is the likely max with this type of work-- SO…
PB 19.32 (19.1ht) 75%=25.5 80%=23.9
PB in the 400m must be adjusted to reflect MJs real ability- not his WR- as he got injured in 1996 before he could put it into the ozone with the 200m- so a realistic PB would be obtained by 2 x 200 + 3.5sec = 41.7ht!!!
Now PB 41.7 75%= 55.6 80% = 52.1
Work across the board on all his training bests and you get a better idea of what’s really going on.
Look at the quality of his speed work- the part that counts-
3 x 275 as fast as 27.2. Think about that for a minute!l
385 in 44 would equal 45.7 in the 400m, or approx 92%.
Does anyone know if the intervals are from a standing start or a run-in? And, if so, which is which?
Charlie,
The 27 sec in the 275, was the 250m split. and the times after the 385m reps are the 200m/350m splits. Not the actual rep times.
Just a few things of note regarding the Baylor program, having observed their training and conversed with both MJ and coach Hart.
For most athletes it is an intesive tempo based program, but for Michael it was extensive tempo due to his higher level of speed reserve. To my mind this is specifically why Baylor athletes tend to peak during their second year in the program. As Charlie has often stated, intensive tempo leads to many things, few of them good (ie: injuries). Take and note of the high number of these within the Baylor program, and remeber that MJ himself had a number of season enders prior to his senior year, at which time he negotiated his trainiing with coach Hart. Also, only one Baylor athlete has improved as a post grad and that’s MJ.
There is little to no rest in the program except on weekends. Coach Hart will tell you that his athletes get to recover in the 22 hours that they aren’t with him. That is as close to an exact quote as I can remember. He also thinks that all out sprinting in practice is a way to get athletes injured, which considering the high levels of intensive tempo he does, seems a correct conclusion.
Anyone wanting to get the whole picture of what MJ dd in training need only to purchase the current USA Track and Field Coaching Manual. That is very accurate representation of what the typical Baylor 400m runner does. Some adjustments were made over he years for MJ, specifically reducing recoveries, and changes in the yearly structure to peak in August, but that is the core of the program. To coach Hart’s credit, he is very open in discussing his methods (I think he has video out there somewhere), and has a great perspective on the event, even if one does differ in outlook regarding training. There are also some very valuable and useful apsect to what he does, particularly regarding race rehersal (event runs), and tempo changes within workouts. LSU, Georgia Tech and East Carolina, all which have had very good 4x400 relays organize their training in similar fashions, though LSU seems to do more supplentary work (ie: jumps training, med ball, etc.).
As for weights MJ’s program was designed to support his work on the track, specifically injury prevention. By 2000 MJ was beginning to think that he had gained to much mass and did try to shed some. To me it looked like he wasn’t successful in this regard, which makes some sense based upon the 7-10 rep nature of what he was doing.
A few other notes:
-By 2000 MJ was living in Dallas and commuting @ 3 times a week to Waco to work with coach Hart.
- As a post grad MJ included more morning distance runs in his GPP (ie: before Christmas)
- By 2000 MJ was doing more work on grass than he did in college, I think due to injury concerns.
-MJ rarely, if ever wore spikes in practice.