I was at a meet last year, and slightly strained my left hammy. Anyhow i go to the competition physio. I started talking to him about various stength training methods, and he claims that if you do cleans, you don’t need to do snatch. This strikes me s odd-especially when snatch is more explosive than cleans. Any thoughts??
I disagree with David, you need to do Cleans as a sprinter as long as you have the technique down, you don’t however, need to do snatches.
Also, mr. magoo, cleans are just as explosive as snatches are, if you find that it is not, then that means something is wrong with your technique. Just my 2¢ :sing:
Robert, Robert, Robert… when will you learn? 
You don’t need to do either. First thing you need to do, you whippet, is squat and squat deep. None of that quarter squat business. I’d kill for your talent, about time you got serious.
Love you bro
:D:D:D
I do powerball snatches and throws though but after my internship years ago and learning about labrum fraying I decided to be lax on the overhead movements such as snatches.
I’m wondering if anyone got any page with pictures of how “cleans”, “squats” and all those looks like… I probably know them but I don’t know the English names of them.
Vito - Rob’s (22.2s at 65k?; 18yrs). limiting factor is limit strength. THis parameter will be most effectively improved through squatting.
alecos, these have animations etc!
goto http://www.exrx.net
more specifically for the olympic power clean snatch etc
goto http://www.exrx.net/Lists/PowerExercises.html
Clemson what is labrum fraying?
David, First of all you had talent, you were just too lazy to do the training for it!
Momentum generated during O-lifts takes tension off the muscles, which makes recruiting fast-twitch fibers “inefficient”.
LMFAO. These people don’t deserve to live.
terminator,
clemson is referring to shoulder problems, and possible tears. this recently happened to me doing snatches. i tore my bankart lesion.
my opinion on cleans or similar exercises are that they surely have a place in sprint training but are not a neccessity.first of all,sprinting first-weights second.safety is a major issue and the last thing you want is to pick up a stupid injury from doing weights.
cleans are for the advanced athlete no matter what and even at that stage the athlete must be technically sound.there are safer exercises that will enhance explosive/strenght levels so guys please keep that in mind,be careful.
last year i was training with a top european 400mH who caused severe damage to both wrists’ from doing power cleans.what did that exercise do for him…nearly ended his season
I don’t know if I would agree cleans are for the advanced athlete only, because if they just start learning them then they can lift enough weight to really hurt themselves. Plus I just think they can be of benefit in a lot of people’s programs. But, of course there’s more than one way to skin a cat.
X-Man, was yer friend wearing wrist straps?? this can prevent wrist injuries. Also, the key to any sport skill is technique 1st, however, everyone will eventually arrive to a skill/fitness plateau and you need to implement new ways to improve FURTHER and one way is resistance training techniques, such as, plyo’s and cleans etc
Well for one thing, you don’t do snatches until you have the support strength to catch the loads you throw up above. That’s why Olylifters do presses of all types.
Getting back to the thread title?
My answer is - ‘it could be!’.
Is the power clean a strength exercise?
Again my answer is - ‘it could be’.
In both cases it depends on the athletes’ Explosive Strength Deficit (ESD). Let me give you a false definition just to illustrate my point:
ESD = Max. Clean / Max deadlift x100
I know many athletes whose ESD <40%. In this case cleans will do little to improve maximum force. (The percentages are less than even Westside’s ‘speed’ days). In contrast I also know lifters whose ESD is >70%. In this case the lift will have positive effects on maximum force whilst also permitting compensatory acceleration. Additionally it provides a useful cap in load since deadlifts can easily cause excess CNS fatigue and run a high risk of lumbar injury.[
Labrum tear:
Think gasket between bone structures in the shoulder joint.
Got scoped in Dec for 2 labrum tears in the same shoulder.
Not fun.
As for this thread, overhead lifts and pull-over/pull-downs put some serious shearing force on the Labrum.
As for the Squat vs Clean/Snatch. Get strong first !!!
(Squat to develop max strength)
then head for the speed lifts
(cleans, clean jerks, snatches and all the variations, as well as jumpsquats and speed squats at 40 to 60% 1RM) testing the full squat 1RM every so often to monitor max strength levels previously gained. Re-visit heavy squats to re-establish max strength and or to do so between periods leading to competition.
I couldn’t agree with David W more. Athletes do not NEED to do any particular exercise and there is no such thing as a sport-specific strength training program. From a general conditioning perspective, athletes need to strengthen what’s weak and stretch what’s tight! If an athlete has tight &/or weak hamstrings he/she will usually end up initiating the second pull (aka 2nd knee bend) early by bending the knees, therefore putting the hamstrings in a shorter, more comfortable position. This will cause the shoulders to get behind the bar (great for deadlifts but the worst thing for OL’s), greatly reducing the power potential of hip extensors, making the top pull very inefficient and the bar usually ends up too far forward (and often not high enough). The way I see it this athlete can perform cleans or snatches ad nauseum, but will only derive minimal benefits from the exercises. What this athlete need to do is a combination of exercises that will strengthen the hamstrings in the stretch position, such as romanian deadlifts; Perform daily/intense hamstring stretches and finally focus on keep in keeping the shoulders in front of the bar until the last possible milliseconds at which point the bar will be “nested” in the crook of the hips or if the athlete has particularly long arms, against the top of the quadriceps. The only things sprinters NEED to do is sprint and even then there is great debate as to the required frequency/intensity/volume of speed (sprinting) sessions.
Coach Mdd makes a great point…is anyone listening?