hello. I was told I lack reactive strength and power in the legs which could be achieved by doing plyometrics ofcourse.
now, I have sprint training at 6 to 8 PM and around 8.30 PM i’m at the gym. Is it wise to do plyometrics in the morning, let’s say 11 AM? Will I be fresh for the speed training?
Why wouldn’t you incorporate plyos into your main workout? Does the program you are working with include plyos already?
If you purchase the Key Concepts ebook you will get a nice graph that shows how you should progress plyometric work. The Key Concepts ebook is an awesome, awesome resource.
Also, it merits mentioning that you have to be careful with volumes. Plyos are high stress. Do you do rudiment jumps in your current program? Before you start with any heavy plyo work I would suggest the rudiment type series (two foot hops, one foot hops, left left right right etc.) and slowly progress into plyometrics in low volumes.
There are some members who do a small amount of plyos for potentiation, for example before accels or max velocity work, but I’m not sure doing plyos at 11 am makes sense. After speed work is probably the most sensible, but only after you have progressed into it with a rudiment series. These are often done in the warmup in low volumes early in the year in my coach’s program.
No the program does not include plyometrics, my coach told me I lacked explosivness and reactive strength and said plyometrics would be very good for me.
I have done plyometrics here and there but never really followed a program. I was thinking the Vertical Jump Bible.
There are 4 routines each 12 weeks long. Beginner, novice, intermediate and advanced.
I’d start with the beginner routine 2x per week
http://i.imgur.com/E2Glm.png
http://i.imgur.com/P0fZW.png
I have a few questions:
#1 What do you guys think about the routine?
#2 Too much volume for a 18yr old? PB: 11.25
#3 Bad idea to them at 11 AM assuming 7 hours later I have speed training, or is the CNS refreshed by then?
Thanks in advance
Should probably incorporate them into your main workouts as suggested, but you can also complex plyos in with your resistance training.
I would be very careful about doing plyo after speed work, If NO drop-off levels are reached, that might be ok.
Before accel and speed work, that might look as simple as this:
A- Fast high knee 2x10m, 1R, 2S
B- Step broad jumps or Bounding 2x10m, 1R, 2S
C- Low to mid hurdle jumps 2x5, 2R, 5S
Total time around 15min
If you lack reactive strength I would put weight training to maintenance volume
example of weight training for lower body
Box jumps / Power step-up 3x8, 2S
Bounding 2x10m, 1R, 2S
Stiff leg bound 2x10m, 1R, 2S
Squat (If you are hips dominant) Reverse lunges (If you are quad dominant) if you are quad dominant 2-3 x 6
Reverse Hyper 2x8
Leg curl 2x8
It’s always tempting to “add more.” You are a sprinter, and you need to run fast first of all. There is no need to add another workout in the morning strictly for plyos.
It’s tempting to get fixated on one particular problem, because we all love to think “wow I’m weak there, so if I fix that then I’ll REALLY be flying.” Charlie said many times, maintain the focus on training to your strengths, and address weakness as necessary but don’t overdo it.
The Vertical Jump Bible is not geared toward someone already doing a full sprint training program, and Baggett says that repeatedly in the intro from what I recall. Kelly Baggett is a very friendly guy, and if you purchased the VJB from him, why don’t you send him an email through his site and ask him what he would suggest volume and progression wise for someone in your situation? You can always use the wise people on this forum for help as well, of course.
Do you do rudiment jumps / hops in your warmup? If you don’t already, I think you need to start there for at least a month or two before you think about plyos.
While on the topic, has your training been going well? Did you progress last year? Are you progressing this year? If so, are you sure you need to change anything?
Plyos aren’t a magic bullet that are going to shave a ton of time off your 100, you just need to incorporate them slowly and at low volume. And while you’re at it, ask yourself “if I’m going to add in plyos, what am I going to take out?”
I was training not too long ago at Variety Village in Toronto when I saw two burly kids jumping over a weight bench forward and backward for 20 to 30 reps. They were on their third set when I stopped and asked them what they were training for and the purpose of the “plyos.” They said that they were doing them to increase their speed for rugby. I watched them run a few 50’s and they had ZERO hip flexibility and horrible form. Hurdle walkovers would have helped them ten times more! Now I know you’re way smarter than that, but plyos are very trendy at the moment. It seems every jackass bootcamp instructor is touting them as a magical cure for everything, so just be careful!
thanks for your replies guys.
Yeah I know what it’s like, I’ve done too much the past 6 weeks in order to break my 60m personal record. I was reading articles regarding plyometrics and came accross depth and shock jumps, they called it the Holy Grail of plyometric exercisess. I was seeing phrases such as “you’ll get quick results” and “it’s a very good way to develop reactive strength” etc… so I thought I’d be flying in no time after such exercises I never done before. but i was wrong… I did beat my personal best however, but only by 0.01. I was very disappointed, I had put alot of effort in the gym and outside the gym, but I guess this is way too much for my body to handle.
To answer your questions…
No I don’t do hops and jumps in my warm up.
My training hasn’t been going so well, I’ve been running ‘injured’ since October which means I couldn’t always give my 100% at speed workouts. Sometimes I just had to stop etc. I feel like I’m not progressing any more since July 2011.
I started training exactly one year ago, did a few sprints every other day. A few weeks later I came accross the CF forums and bought GPP. After 3-4 weeks of hill training I came back on the track and I was flying, my 100m time went from 12.0 to 11.50. I joined a track club in may and I always felt like I did more on my own. My best times were in July (11.25 and 22.60) and since then I haven’t really progressed… (11.40, 23.00…) I don’t get it. Everyone and myself included thought that after the winter season i’d be hitting great times, but I just simply can’t see myself progressing and that’s why I added depth jumps and shock jumps into my training. Nothing changed. I can’t seem to understand why I’m not progressing, especially since I started sprinting a year ago.
Hi there,
I’ve been following your journal as well. What happened to your foot? I somehow hurt my foot in my last indoor race last February. It took until September of this year for it to be 100% recovered. Now I know everyone is different, but I know another guy with a foot problem and it’s lasted him all indoor season. If your indoor season is over, maybe it’s time to take a step back and see how you can rest and recover. It’s going to be hard to progress if you aren’t healthy and able to run full speed in practise. You are young, maybe it’s time to take some rest.
There are a lot of really smart and experienced people on this forum, and it’s hard to say what is holding you back from progressing without getting an idea of your training, your current injury status, and coaching situation. There are simply too many variables, but it sounds like your program might not be progressing smoothly from one element to the next. Are you carefully tracking what you do in practise? Do you have a season plan, and do you work backward from your goal?
The pain gradually increased week by week. I’m pretty sure it’s due to my supinating shoes which puts alot of stress on my ankles and outside of the foot.
Below is an image of the pain area. If anyone experienced this or knows how to get rid of the pain, i’d love know more.
Maybe your lack of reactivity is just you and not a deficit in your training. By all means try things out but be careful not to overload yourself and get injured trying to improve it. Often it is best to work on improving yourself THROUGH your strengths rather than by directly attacking your weaknesses - hence the need for different approaches to training (long to short, short to long, ends to middle etc…)
I have heard the sentence “Train to your strengths not weaknesses” but I honestly don’t know what my strengths are (I’ve only been sprinting for 1 year). Could you give me some examples of strengths and weaknesses in sprinting? if that’s not a stupid question lol.
You said your reactivity isn’t the greatest, so you immediately decided to try to fit heavy duty plyometrics into your program, which seems like a quick and logical fix- but wasn’t.
Basically, since you’ve been sprinting for a year, if you remain patient, take care of your body and stay injury free, the overall program will take effect and your reactivity will likely improve itself over time.
I can give you a personal example of trying to attack weaknesses head on and failing. I’m very tall and lightly muscled, and started out on a short to long program. I am not very powerful, so of course I tried to make myself into a more powerful and strong sprinter because I’m less explosive and weak in the weight room compared to others. I busted my ass all indoor season last year, and ended up running .05 slower than the previous year in the 60m. I was also unable to really control my weight properly, and was probably in an overtraining state for much of the indoor season.
This year I played to my speed endurance strengths, and I ran .01 faster than last year in the 60 despite barely lifting at all and not really focusing on short speed. More importantly, I ran 0.31 faster in the 200 which was a big indoor PB, plus a 2 second 300m PB, and am hopefully setting myself up for some decent 200 and 400 times outdoors.
The advice you got to not directly attack your weaknesses was very profound. Hopefully you don’t need to learn the hard way like me!
Thanks alot for the explanation, I see what you mean now. I’m guessing speed endurance is my strength since I ran a 22.61 on the 200m without much background training (PB for 100m is 11.25). We had a 5 day camp with an elite coach and he told me I’d be a good 200-400m runner. Hopefully this season I’ll be able to discover what my strengths are.
By the way, I tried PM’ing you T-Slow but it says your inbox is full and you need to clear some space.
First of all, you need to be congratulated for being motivated enough to seek out answers on your own, especially at such a young age. There are very few athletes with your level of motivation and willingness to seek out answers despite the fact those answers may challenge your current understanding.
About your strengths or where you fit in, don’t worry too much about what some elite coach says. Remember that the very best of the best coaches understand and accept that they have no idea who is truly going to be the fastest out of a group of developmental level sprinters. If you read Speed Trap, you will see that Ben was no freak of nature when he first started sprinting.
Think of guys like Walter Dix, who is “too short” for the 100 metres, yet runs sub 10 and ran a spectacular 19.41 in the 200 last year. Of course, let’s not forget about the sprinters who were considered “too tall” for the 100 metres; Asafa Powell at 6’3 who was the first of the great tall 100 metre men, leading of course to the even taller Usain Bolt who is even faster. There are a thousand ways to skin a cat, and these guys prove it.
All I’m saying is don’t worry too much about where you fit in at this point despite what some coach says, and enjoy your training, keep yourself healthy, keep to a sensible training program (that’s where the very smart and experienced members here can help) and you should see continual improvement.
Thank you. When I get back to the track I’ll follow my coach’s program without adding exercises that burn my CNS. I’m going to have to trust him and stop focusing on my weaknesses. Patience is key…
Also, don’t discount the plyometric effect of sprinting itself! I recall Charlie pointing out that sprinting was the best form of plyometric training for sprinting.
That’s the whole point of having a coach. It’s all very good to come on here and ask questions etc but as an athlete what you really need to do is find a good coach and trust them to get you better.
That is what I thought the forum was all about. Coaches having discussions.
