You’re forgetting about the overt advantage of the back straight, a longer straight allows for a faster 300m split, hence Wairners 32-. Also deceleration is going to be less on the home straight. If you look at the overall splits most quarter miles would exchange longer straights for shorter bends.
any chance of getting these vids to view?
Wow - I never thought Wariner would have the pure speed to get close to 43 flat. I always saw him as more of a 4/800 type runner. Out of interest do you guys think with specific training he would have a good shot at the 800m WR?
I’m pretty impressed all around, I must say. How does Wariner get such a fast last 100m? Its amazing…
Perhaps you could pass along the survey to KK to illuminate him about the correct execution of the 400m.
hey he got the 1kt for himself beating the meet record, did he not say he would?
No survey results to pass on only common sense. Moving in a straight line is always going to be faster then a curve. In terms of the correct execution of the 400m, all I can say is that John Smith and KK principles to ¼ mile training are at opposites. :eek:
Gee, in the many discussions John and I have had over the years, we agree on many aspects of training. But maybe you know better
From the posts i have read about John smith, and form what KK has said on this forum, i got the impression they are both very similiar. Different workouts, but the effect the workouts have on the system look very similiar. Particually in regards to the pacing at speed for that last 200m.
John has his ideas, I have my own. He likes over-distance to deliver the endurance for the last 100m, I prefer something I believe is more specific. But my program still includes sets such as 3x2x360m hills (total 700+). He likes to regulate the rhythm against the clock for each 100m segment. I do it only for the opening 100m and then look at longer segments (so as not to overstate the importance of segmental splits for fear that my athletes will forget it’s all one single flowing performance: not 4x100m). He probably puts more emphasis in on strength work in the gym, but then he had a gym at UCLA and Art Venegas to oversee the lifting. I had no-one else to help me, but even my best females still squatted double bodyweight.
John and I have had many talks on the road, not since Athens, but certainly in the 20 years prior. He even asked me to help him write his book, but we live so far apart I felt at the time it was impractical. So, yes , we agree on many things even if we have taken different routes to get there. Maybe if I had UCLA behind me and the capacity to recruit athletes on scholarships, I’d have attracted some great talent too and maybe I’d have achieved more. I’ve never had meaningful funding for my program, much less the possibility of a university backup. Most I ever got was a grant of $2000 - with which I somehow helped 2 people reach 400 Olympic finals at the same Games. But John has the score on the board, the medals on the table. He is still the most successful 400 coach in my eyes, although surely coach Hart is coming up fast.
JS places more emphasis on distance work like 600m reps even during comp phase. Also JS stays away from all out SE max runs.
I rarely saw Darren go further then 300m in training, and most of the time it was close to flat out intensities. It was back in the early 90’s and maybe your philosophy has changed.
Remember that story in the telegraph about John Steffenson doing 8x200 after running 45.00 back in February. It had no truth to it. Ironic that the papers printed it and people on here ranted on about it. Unless you directly see JS workouts time after time, reading and talking about them won’t lead you to the truth.
ah well then, I don’t have your apparently vast background knowledge on the subject and others can judge that by your comments and your achievements competing in or coaching the 400.
But if Steffensen says he ran 8x200 after his race, I presume people should pay him the courtesy of taking him on his word. Are you saying Steffensen is a liar?
oh forget it. … :rolleyes:
Well I was at the track after the race and he didn’t do 8x200. His reason for saying that I can’t disclose because “what said in practice stays in practice”. I have to implicate too many names to get to the bottom of this, its better to leave things as they are. Just as you say oh forget it :rolleyes:
Moving around a big corner is a hel of a lot faster than a small one also- what you gain for one, you give up for the other. Thats why the old rule was changed (equal dist straight to turn) and tracks have been updated to biggers turns over the last 40 years.
I also have more than a passing familiarity with both JS and KK- but, as you say, forget it!
I didn’t know JS had wrote a book, is it currently in print? What is/was/will be the title?
Thanks
if he ever runs 141.1, i’ll buy him a small country, and i work 20 hours a week at 7$ an hour and i’m pretty sure i have enough time to accumliate the funds before he would be prepared to break into the 140.xx’s.
from an event outside the 800, the guys who might have had a shot at it would have been edwin moses and noah ngeny. Moses had like a 39 inch inseam and attempted to prefect 11 steps between the 400 barriers but never quite got it down. He kinda had a weird way of training, he’d work out with high schools in the detroit area, and a story i was told went something along the following. He was going to do his own workout and was just there to use the track and catch up with one of the assistants. To the coach of the high school he basicly said “you’re welcome to have your sprinters join, oh can i get a watch on my times for my repeats”. The coach, “sure what time are you running your quarters in?”. Moses: “oh no, i’m doing 8’s, but probably about 2:03 and faster, and i’ll have 2 minutes rest inbetween”. The coach, “how many are you doing?”. Moses: “i normally do 16, but today i’m only gonna do 12”. the sucession of times was 2:00-2:03 for about the first 8ish, and then 1:57, 1:56, 1:53 and 1:52. Seems a bit crazy. low 150’s are really fast. Also the next day he supposedly ran 13.3 over the 39 inch highs. I dont know enough about the 800 repeat capacities of a 400h guy or an 800 runner to know if the times are embellished or not.
but, i guess its not totally absoultely crazy, coe did 7x800 on 45 seconds rest in: 2:08-2:06-2:04-2:02-2:00-1:58-1:56 if this is to be belived:http://www.runnersweb.com/running/rw_news_frameset.html?http://www.runnersweb.com/running/news/rw_news_20050227_PPO_800M.html
noah ngeny has the 1k world record and ran the #2 mile of all time, and beat El-G, so if someone would have come on down to 8 from the 1500 he would have been it.
But in all honesty, i doubt anyone would have challanged kipkiter’s mark. world records are ussally world records for a reason.
are you a troll?
I declined the offer and never heard anything more on the subject, sorry, don’t know if he went ahead with the idea. But for sure, he has a story to tell.