Shaf,
http://216.65.18.34/Airway.htm
I think it’s a waste of money but athletes that I work with (football) swear by it to the point that they force their moms to use their credit card! I do admit it’s a lot like smelling salts and when it’s been a long day in training it get’s you amped up. I get alert…it’s like shoving a icicle up your nose. I have had some great workouts on it but realize it’s placebo and just a dialator.
as for NFD I will wait for his response No23.
I think the quantity is the key to getting any type of effect. As others have pointed out, most glutamine is used by the gut, very little makes it into the system. Now, this isn’t necessarly bad, if the gut is getting glutamine from the diet, it doesn’t need to pull it from other sources (i.e. body stores). But you have to take a lot.
I beelieve I have seen the suggestino of 5 grams glutamine being helpful for endurance athletes under heavy training (assumes caloric balance). glutamine/BCAA probably becomes far more important under dieting conditions, but you need a lot to have an effect.
Lyle
Lyle,
With the cocktail being twice a day what do you see from a metabolic standpoint. Protein metabolism has some interesting aspects…perhaps you could expand on this. The immogrow helps the mucosal lining of the stomach from the research…perhaps making the glutamine more available?
I’m tempted to think it’d be better to dose the glutamine all at once, perhaps if you give the gut all it can handle in a given time period, you can force more through/into the bloodstream (a guess).
I recall one study which found that small doses (2 g; it was that weird glutamine/GH study) got through as well; perhaps the small amounts doesn’t activate the gut uptake/utilization mechanisms. Maybe small doses throughout the day would be workeable as well (question: what is the threshold to activate gut utilization?).
Basically either very small/frequent or very large/infrequent doses to try and deal with gut utilization (assuming your goal is to get glutamine past the gut in the first place).
Or, it may simply not matter, by ensuring the gut has plenty of glutamine, this limits the need to produce it elsewhere in the body (i.e. via breakdown/transamination of BCAA’s). End result will still be that tissues maintain glutamine levels better than if you hadn’t taken it. Hope that makes sense.
I think of glutamine as one of those precautionary things, ensure good immune systm function during periods of heavy loading.
Lyle
It might be helpful, as a contrasting idea, to look at www.mercola.com and search on ‘glutamine’. Interesting viewpoint from a researcher there that claims that glutamine produces ‘excitotoxins’ in the brain, can cause neurons to die…he says that for hard-working athletes, its OK, but as Clemson says, if its a secondary supp, then perhaps a word of caution is prudent. Oh, also it can produce hypoglycemia as well. Mercola can be a little kooky but he states some good ideas too. Just a fyi…
CASeal
My article “brain drain” is being sent on Wednesday…the Dr.Blaylock article is not referenced at all and has some far reaching cause and effect relationships. I am not worried about bad chemistry with my head from BCAA’s and glutamine.
I’ve always had to take large doses of glutamine to get even a moderately noticable effect. ~20g daily, usually in one dose, typically in the evenings. Other lifters I’ve talked to have noticed the same thing. I just seem to stay healthier while taking it.
Didn’t Osmo have an additive to their supplements that supposedly did something to the mucosal lining of the stomach and small intestine. LPC or something? It’s not in their supplements now, and I seem to remember some kind of potential problems with it.
ImmunoGro does exactly that. It improves overall gut health internally leading downline to many fantastic responses. Many particularily like the improved absorption capabilities, especially amino acids. Overall the effect can be profound if used in sufficient doses. In my opinion, this is much more valuable than glutamine, but it won’t be as widely used until more marketing $$ is pushed into it. Just look at the available peptides:
Typical MINIMUM profile per serving:
Immunoglobulin G (IgG): 1200-1350mg
Immunoglobulin M (IgM): 135-150mg
Immunoglobulin A (IgA): 15-18mg
Transferrins: 27-30mg
Immunoregulators (Proline rich polypeptides): 153-159mg
IgF1: 16-18mcg
This is per 3g and I recommend 6g per day, although 3 will work well. At this rate $18 would last almost 17 days. Compared to the cost for most people taking 20+ grams of glutamine per day, I think it is at least worth a try on this product. We are shipping a ton of this, so the price may drop at least for specials time and again.
Zepp,
What is the best time to take ImmunoGro–pre or post workout? Is there any reason to load for the first week with immungro or is there diminishing returns at doses over 6g? Also, what advantages does immunogro have over colostrum?
I dont mean to sound really stupid, but why is there no option for HMB on the Protein Customizer at blackstarlabs.com?
Heres the link http://www.blackstarlabs.com/?cPath=30&products_id=164
You have to call them.
Does not matter when you consume ImmunoGro. The gut snatches it up so we do not need the extra circulation.
ImmunoGro vs. Colostrum
Colustrom usually only has 10% immunopeptides where ImmunoGro is 45% IgG alone, plus the other peptides as well. So just from a cost factor alone ImmunoGro is by far the best method to consume the immunomodulatory peptides.
The only issue you will ever have with ImmunoGro is that it can foam a bit in a shaker cup. Nothing horrible though. Working on a new vitashot with ImmunoGro right now. Looking for later this year for this. I should be able to give more details in a couple of weeks.
I just recieved my Clemson cocktail, Ice, and Go. I’ll report back in a couple of weeks with my results.
The articel in T-mag? I guess thats the one that Berardi wrote, if so when I looked it over my first thought was “doesn´t anybody read the referenses” and my next was “is this something new”.
I´m still a bit confused about the study you have given, there is 16 patients who is still left after screening and such in that study so where do you get the two patients from?
There was an increase in bodymass as well.
So is there something in that study that supports the use of glutamine for recovery that I have missed or why did you put it there?
Bjorn
Bjorn,
I live 20 minutes from the a medical hot bed…walking distance from the university track I can pick some big brains and observe some reasearch. Glutamine is tossed in as an insurance protocol and when it’s eliminated it makes the drink a little more tasty but like lyle said the immune benefits are the angle…
T-mags article on glutamine was NOT written by JB but it is well researched. I still feel that glutamine by itself is not powerfull enough to enable much change with athletes and AIDs research is not a perfect carryover set of studies.
Yes. There’s an old axiom about the most important part of training being an ability to train consistently. This means not getting injured or sick. Intensive training, especially endurance training tends to negatively affect immune function.
Ensuring that the immune system is supported during heavy training is simply good insurance to make sure that the athlete doesn’t lose valuable training time by getting sick.
Glutamine is part of that
so are anti-oxidants: vitamin C and E
carbs during before/during/after workout (to limit an increase in inflammatory cytokines such as IL-6)
high quality protein
eating sufficient calories (dieting having a tendency to really whack the immune system)
Lyle
I just bought 10 pounds of this stuff. You have to add the Vitamin C… and I opted out on the HMB and glutamine. We’ll see how it goes 
nArKed, what percents did you use or did you talk to the guys and they took care of it for you?
For the anticatabolic cocktail sans glutamine and HMB you can just buy micellar casein or milk protein isolate with 5% immuno-grow. Add .25grams of vitamin C and the rest of the stuff at the time of consumption. If you need the other stuff just talk to Ryan… he will take care of you.
My PW mix was 45% Whey Concentrate/50% Glucose/2.5% MSM/2.5%Glucosamine
I like the base mixes better. You can add what you want based on your current state and workouts. I got MPI because of cost. Casein is almost double. I also ordered some Beta-Alanine… we’ll see how that works out.
Great, thanks a lot. I’ll probably do without HMB but keep the glutamine and immunogrow for sure.