Ok havent benched since june, only been doing frog stands a couple days a week on and off for the month of september. Previous pb for 225 for reps-3 reps. Did it 10 times today, no warm up, easy, had two reps left in me. That equated to a 315 bench press. haha ian is a mad scientists.
That’s awesome man! How far into those frog stand progressions are you able to go?
For those who don’t know what he’s referring to I think this is article explains what he’s been doing:
http://www.dragondoor.com/cgi-bin/articles.pl?rm=mode3&articleid=229
not very far being as large as i am. i have lost 5 lbs however. i can hold a straight arm frog stand, very little pressure on my elbows, for around 30-45 seconds.
That’s amazing, I never knew bw stuff could do things like that. How many sets did you do and for how many seconds or minutes was each “rep”. Would doing weights for one month and this body weight variation stuff for one month be a good idea? Because that article has made me really interested in this.
And do you think it’s true when he says you can be stronger from bw exercises if you did it the for the same time that you would do free weights? I don’t really think so, as long as you know how to conduct your workouts. I may be wrong though, any info would be appreciated.
depends on ur goals, but hey its workin fo me. use it as an assistance exercise if you are going to do weights also. I just do until its too hard to hold anymore, rest for a while, do it again, while i am sitting around watching tv. works great. and i think you can, however they need to be used in conjunction. i deadlifted over 400 the first time i ever did it, but i wasnt 135 lbs, i was closer to 200. So i think the two used together would yield great results. I mean honestly how many people do you know the first time they ever touch a weight deadlift triple their body weight and bench over double it?
I do lockoffs (one-arm holds at the top of the chin-up) to train upper-body pulling strength, this at the suggestion of Coach Sommer as well. I do three maximal-duration lockoffs per arm, beginning one lockoff every two minutes, followed by assisted one-arm chins.
When I started this program, my bodyweight chins hopped up from 18 to 21. Only time will reveal whether this was a brief anomaly or whether these increases will continue.
Another question, do you think bw exercises such as these are a good way to break plateaus? I think they would be, like after your vert plateaus or something, you have to start using variations and stuff, but stuff like this probably helps too. anyone got any other ideas or info on this?
Have you been doing any upper body work with weights?
nope i have not
First off, Numba, congratulations on your PR.
However, a clarification is in order.
The efficacy of incorporating gymnastics movements will likely decrease as an athletes intramuscular coordination and limit strength levels increase.
Numba, if I recall, your bodymass is in the 230-240lbs range and you are under 6ft tall. Your current bench pressing strength (225x10) height, at 240 or so, indicates that your limit strength and intramuscular coordination are far from developed to any high level (I would say this even if you weighted 200lbs at your height, assuming that you are not obese). Therefore, it is no surprise that various relative strength drills (eg gymnastics movements) will increase your neural efficiency and max strength to some degree. Additionally, don’t put to much stock in 1RM calculators. These calculators and charts do not account for the numerous mechanical and physiological differences inherent to different athletes.
What you will find is that as your limit strength continues to increase, the efficacy of the gymnastic drills will decrease.
Even the article that Kelly presented the link for should be put into perspective. Although the results are impressive for the youths performing heavy weighted pullups and deadlifts at very low bodymasses. We must observe that the numbers, when compared to the truly strong, are very low.
For example, it is definitely very impressive for a 110lb youth to perform 8 weighted pullups with a 50lb weight. However, as an example, a few years ago at a bodyweight of 215, I could perform one weighted chin up with a 120lb weight. Now at a bodyweight of 242-245 at 6’1’’, and far from truly strong, I can still perform over 20 bodyweight pullups and roll out of bed any day of the week and peform about 25 reps with 225 in the bench press. I pulled an easy 600lbs off of pin 2 the other day. My point is that although I am NOT TRULY STRONG, I do possess a certain amount of relative strength, limit strength and intramuscular coordination, and the employment of gymnastic drills would likely do absolutely NOTHING to further my limit strength development.
CP has sited that Andre Benoit, an OL Luge athlete, could perform wide grip pullups with a 120lb dumbbell for a set of 3 reps on a 401 tempo. That is TRULY STRONG.
A first time deadlift of 400lbs, for a 135lb individual is definitely impressive, however, a 400lb DL is a novice pull for an elite male 135lb powerlifter.
Again, my point here is that one must assess the level of physical preparedness of either themselves, or the athletes whom they train, before they incorporate relative strength/gymnastics exerices in an effort to increase limit strength.
There’s nothing magical about any training means. The key is to utilize the optimal means relative the level of physical preparedness of the athlelete.
Again, congratulations on the PR’s, but be sure and maintain perspective on why you made the gains that you did.
wellof course it isnt, but why not use it as an assistance exercise? I am not obese, my bodyfat is under 20%, I am what you would call an easy gainer, I touch weights I get bigger and bigger, and while you are right it is nothing for an elite 135 lb lifter, how about for a 14 yr old lifter? That was the guys age as he had to lift for football to see how strong he was. And all these are done by children 14 and under. Thanks for the congrats, and your strength levels are impressive.
This, would be a wiser course of action for most. Again, this is all relative to the level of physical preparedness and training goal of the athlete in question.
I would definitely place a higher value on various calisthenic drills (gymnastic drills) for youths, or individuals who have not developed any significant level of muscular coordination or max strength. And although they clearly develop limit strength for relatively untrained, or young individuals, gymnastic drills should not be viewed as a means to improve limit strength for advanced level athletes.
Numba, as for you, bleed the well till it’s dry brother.
Interesting post, gets things in perspective, but for boys that age, thats impressive!
Would you even use them? I tried the beginner stuff and I find it tough to do. I understand it’s not to improve limit strength for advanced level althletes but it really hits the core hard. I get cramps in my abs just doing the tuck front lever after 10 seconds. I could barely do tuck planche for 5 seconds before crashing head on to the floor. I’m going to incorprate these at the end of workouts several times a week. It takes only a few minute to them. We’ll see how that works out with modified westside purely for strength only with minimal mass gain.
Everything works, it’s just a question for how long and does it make sense to incorporate it into your training program, and will the rewards be relative to your training goal.
If your training WSB style, then performing a weighted sit up with a loaded barbell on your back will do a lot more for you than gymnastic drills.
Allow your training goal to define the means.