Well done.
the problem with training motor patterns on the track is 1. sprinting represents a massive overload in the form of forces for most athletes. an individual can experience more than 6 times their bodyweight on one leg at top speed. this is much more force than many can effectivly absorb and so we have hamstring injuries poor development ect. its like if you were trying to increase your bench and you could only bench 225 but you were trying to move 800 lbs. the effect would most likly be injury and lack of development. 2. unless you have a good coach like charlie alot of peolpe dont know how to run properly. another cause of injury. it has been shown that the biggest difference between elite sprinters and the novice or intermediate sprinter is ground contact time. ground contact time consists of absorption, stoping and then mobility, or eccentric isometric and concentric actions. the more rapidly you can absorb the force your body produces from sprinting the more rapidly you can generate force and therefor the less the ground contact time and thus faster sprint times. this is not the only factor in sprinting fast but individuals can see rapid safe increases in sprinting ability.
How can the GHR be the best exercise when the limiting factor is knee flexion?
Thanks.
I know, but they are called rev. hypers by some around here so I thought it better to check.
How do these (back hyper) rate compared to a reverse hyper? Same/similiar muscle emphasis?
easy, its not limited to knee flexion.
How is it not? Have you ever done a GHR?
i own a ghr bench
Its not limited TO knee flexion, but donāt you think it is limited BY knee flexion?
lol okay james, nobody said limited to, I said limited by knee flexion. Again, how is it not limited by knee flexion? Who can do the knee flexion portion, but not hold hip extension position?
This link shows a reverse hyper.
http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/GluteusMaximus/WtReverseHyperextension.html
How did you paste that clip into your reply?
What about box squats? Has anyone used them with success?
There are alot of people who will tell you they are dangerous, but I think if they are supervised properly, they could be used v. effectively to keep depth and technique consistent?
I have never met anyone that has done a lot of box squatting that has told me this. We do variations of the box squat almost exclusively, and have had no injuries and far fewer nagging complaints, such as sore back, sore knees etc. My nephew was stuck at around 450 (with gear) at 198 @ age 19. After 6 months of box squatting, his knees and back started feeling better and his squat shot up to over 600lbs., He did 601 in competition and was red lighted after a good 625 for stepping forward to soon. Now, at a age 20, heās doing well over 500 on the box and will be shooting for 700 at his next meet, still at 198lbs. The point being, no injuries and less soreness/nagging complaints has allowed him to progress furtherā¦and he attributes this change to box squatting.
I agree but I had to choose one as well. Reality dictates that you choose whichever exercises meet your needs.
why is there such a big weight difference (500/600) between box and free squatting, i thought you be able to squat 90-95% of your free squat.
no how is knee flexion limiting at all. as if knee flexion devlopment works in oppostion of hip extension. think about the excercise think about where force is biomechanically most effeciently expressed during the sprint. also consider the static spring model of dynamic muscular actions. things should start comming together for you.
couldnt agree with you more charlie. thats why there is no āmost important hamstring excerciseā
James you make no sense. When you do a glute ham raise, what is the hardest portion of the movement? What is the limiting portion of the movement? It is when knee flexion occurs. When, in sprinting, is such a powerful knee flexion like that in a ghr needed? Why is this at all better than squatting? I am not looking for you to throw out bogus questions, I want to hear some answers.
lol they arent bogus question they are questions to make you think so that you arent simply fed an answer but actually understand the information. your statements tell me you dont understand the information. have u ever heard of the socratic method of teaching. the teacher asks the questions the students answer. why you ask, because in this way the individual can not only absorb information but also have an understanding of that information. its useless otherwise. but you would rather be fed the information. and i promise you that you will not understand the information unless you do some thinking on your own. but thats not what you wanted to hear is it?
the hardest part of the movement is when your body is parallel to the ground in this postion the force of your bodyweight and gravity acting on the weight is at its greatest. all the force generated by gravity and your body weight must be supproted by muscle tension. as you flex the knees the force required to maintain body postion or move the body decreases (basic vector math).
when is it most adventageous for the hamstrings glutes ect to produce force during the sprint? when the foot lands directly under the body. hmmm sounds like the ghr. now also take into consideration the static spring model of dynamic muscular actions (im not gunna explain it your gunna have to do some work on your own). muscle tension is generated around very finite joint angles during balistic actions. that should give you a clue to why the ghr is so beneficial. its not just about training the muscles in hip extension.
do you understand? probably not because i had to tell you instead of you thinking for yourself. please if you wish for me to help you answer your questions show some respect and i will do the same.
Have you heard of The Clouds? I am not asking to be fed an answer, I am trying to figure out your position that completely ignores practical experience from everybody I know who has used a GHR bench.
the hardest part of the movement is when your body is parallel to the ground in this postion the force of your bodyweight and gravity acting on the weight is at its greatest. all the force generated by gravity and your body weight must be supproted by muscle tension. as you flex the knees the force required to maintain body postion or move the body decreases (basic vector math).
Thatās all well and great, but what parts of the hamstring are moving your body up? When you sprint and your leg is straight under you, what role does knee flexion play in propelling you forward? Any at all?
when is it most adventageous for the hamstrings glutes ect to produce force during the sprint? when the foot lands directly under the body. hmmm sounds like the ghr. now also take into consideration the static spring model of dynamic muscular actions (im not gunna explain it your gunna have to do some work on your own). muscle tension is generated around very finite joint angles during balistic actions. that should give you a clue to why the ghr is so beneficial. its not just about training the muscles in hip extension.
That says nothing of how a GHR, which trains mostly knee flexion, is going to help a sprint. If you want to talk about specifics about when the best time to produce force is, maybe you consider what is going to produce force at that time. Is it the the muscles and tendons involved in knee flexion? When in a sprint are you parallel to the ground?
do you understand? probably not because i had to tell you instead of you thinking for yourself. please if you wish for me to help you answer your questions show some respect and i will do the same.
Honestly, Iāve read so many of your posts and talked to you personally and your story changes every time, so it is hard to take you seriously. For example, you said before you didnāt have any equipment to train with, but now you apparently own a GHR bench.
i dont have the energy to explain what to me seems so obvious. think about it you seem intelligent you should get it. keep in mind the excercise does not need to be performed like a bodybuilder. and maximal tension can be created by absorbing the force generated by falling to the parallel postion.
i never said i dont have any equipment what i did say is that i live in florida and california and all my stuff is in california at the time i spoke to you i was in florida. im actually moving back to cali on monday. seriously man your missing the biggest point THE STATIC SPRING MODEL.
i never said that knee flexion helps to propel an athelte down a track, which again tells me your not getting it. maybe im being too harshā¦
if you generate force when your body is parallel to the ground on a ghr bench the muscle isnt actually contracting (becomeing shorter) it is however creating a force. the same type of action that occurs in the support phase of a sprint. get it. you cant simply get on the bench and grind out a few reps and see the benefit you have to do it a specefic way. absorb the force generated by your falling bodymass (STATIC SPRING MODEL!!!). please tell me you get it. please god tell me you get it. you may not agree but please tell me you atleast understand where im comming from. if not i just cant help you. im sorry.
James,
I understand that the level of muscular tension needed is greatest at the bottom when the hips and knees are fully extended because at this point the lever arm is longest. What I am saying is that the ability to extend/maintain extension of the hips at this point is a non-issue whereas the ability to flex at the knee at this point in the exercise is much more difficult. When sprinting the force is applied in much the same position but its hip extension rather than knee flexion which is providing the force, is it not? Iām not sure what you are getting atā¦
Regarding the static spring model; guess I have to do my homework. Not sure thats gonna happen right now because I gotta get studying for finals!
So you are talking about reactive glute-ham raises?
i never said i dont have any equipment what i did say is that i live in florida and california and all my stuff is in california at the time i spoke to you i was in florida. im actually moving back to cali on monday. seriously man your missing the biggest point THE STATIC SPRING MODEL.
iām not going to bother digging up what you have said, I am sure others know what is up.
i never said that knee flexion helps to propel an athelte down a track, which again tells me your not getting it. maybe im being too harshā¦
I never said you said that. I am asking you how can you train that position with an exercise where the limiting portion is knee flexion.
if you generate force when your body is parallel to the ground on a ghr bench the muscle isnt actually contracting (becomeing shorter) it is however creating a force. the same type of action that occurs in the support phase of a sprint. get it. you cant simply get on the bench and grind out a few reps and see the benefit you have to do it a specefic way. absorb the force generated by your falling bodymass (STATIC SPRING MODEL!!!). please tell me you get it. please god tell me you get it. you may not agree but please tell me you atleast understand where im comming from. if not i just cant help you. im sorry.
I understand completely what you are saying, but it is wrong or at the very least misguided. Iāll let somebody else continue this, but I wish you well believing that knee flexion is not the limiting factor of the GHR.