Hey Kitkat, much thanks. With a few tweaks to fit a 50 year old man I took your general prep program through one time and then simply did variable rotations of your transition workouts and I just WON the M50 Masters National Championships running a 53.80. Thanks a ton to you, Charlie and all on this board for input and information. We all rock!
Fantastic effort, well done.
Are you able to provide some more specifics about how you implemented it?
53.8 at 50+ is great running, whether you win or not. If you’re happy, we all are. Brilliant job kidscoach
Thanks Kitkat and John. John, I basically followed it verbatim. I just took the liberty of starting with reps as fast as I was comfortable doing them in April and as I improved in fitness upped the ante in intensity until I got through the six weeks. My favorite was the 2x2x200 although I feel like I under-performed cuz 23.9 200 should produce a faster than 53.8 400.
Thanks, what sort of times were you running pre KK routine?
I ran 55.9 last year. And had gone 53.2 about 4 years prior.
Not down playing those but that makes your 53.8 even more impressive, well done 
I would like some thoughtful feedback for this 400m thread on the implication to training of changes to the format of 400m competition in the major championships.
Through the 1980s and up until at least the mid-1990s if not longer in some tournaments, it had been traditional to schedule four rounds of the 400m for men if not also the women even at the lesser Commonwealth Games meet.
Now at recent World Championships and certainly also in Beijing the 400m has been reduced to three rounds.
The implication is that the first-round “softener” has been eliminated and the tournament starts with all but the finalists needing to run a PB or close just to survive their opening heat and advance straight to the semi-finals.
I’m very interested to hear thoughts from the forum on whether anyone feels that the usual pre-requisit emphasis on a broad Aerobic Base is now less of a factor - or indeed more of a factor in at least the GPP.
Or whether 400m people should cut to the chase and leap sooner into the more painful lactic tolerance sessions.
thanks All, kk.
I can’t give a detailed reply just yet, but could the lack of general speed in the avg elite 400m runner(oxymoron)be one of the causes to their ability to come back after having to run so fast due to the missing round?
This goes for all of the 400m guys. I know it seems simple that the better 400m guys will have less of an issue, but I can see problems coming about for even some fo the top athletes.
Having less overall speed in some cases leads to more effort being used to run the same speed that would otherwise be a walk in the park for the same athlete. Maybe that extra round helped loosen things up a bit, where the 3 round format doesn’t allow that, forcing them as you say to work much harder ending up with less for the following rounds.
I believe if they were a little faster, they would be able to run the 1st round a little more comfortably. This added speed of course would have to come at no expense of the required fitness to run the 400m.
I’m not sure how to interpret it. I guess the first question is: What were the qualifying times out of round one now compared to round two before?
I thought it was interesting that despite the apparently easier 400m programme in Beijing (only three rounds and one day rest before the final) almost everyone ran 0.5-1s slower in the final than in previous rounds. Could the rest day have allowed for the onset of DOMS thus causing a performance decline in the final?
i think the weather was not to good for the 400m final
Round 1 qualifying times in Seoul 1988, for example, were about 1 second or more slower than Rd 1 in Beijing (for men)
I wasn’t in Beijing so can’t testify to the weather there, but the Birdsnest seemed pretty insulated against any major wind interference to performances within.
I was there in Auckland 1990 to see a guy named Darren Clark run 44.60 in his fourth 400m race within 28-hours and they ran the final into a pretty stiff breeze on the backstraight due to wind funnelling caused by the stadium stands configuration and the prevailing wind. He had run something like 45.6 a few hours earlier to win his semi.
Now 44.60 would have comfortably won silver in Beijing.
Like Charlie, I’m not sure how to interpret it either.
Maybe we still need that high-level aerobic threshhold work in GPP and continuing right up to just before the taper.
That would help develop and maintain the “flush and feed” vascular network to a degree high enough developed to make a real difference in getting rid of the protein damage (not just lactic acid etc) which accompanies severe racing over the longer sprints (400/200).
Maybe the more general aerobic work still needs to be done in all developing athletes moving towards the 400m event, but perhaps that work can be moved forward closer toward real threshhold aerobic/anaerobic zone in those with more training background.
The 2000 Sydney Olympics was the last time there were 4 rounds of the 400m. In Athens 2004 and Beijing 2008 there have been three rounds.
In 2000 there were 9 first round heats. 32 athletes advanced to the second round of 4 heats. Of the 32 athletes the slowest qualifier was 46.14 (automatic Q). The slowest non-automatic qualifier was 45.90. Only one athlete broke 45s in the first round – Alvin Harrison with 44.96s. The 8th fastest time was 45.39. Of the top 8 fastest times in the first round, only 4 (of the top 8) athletes ultimately made the final.
11 athletes ran sub 45.50s and the average time of the 32 qualifiers was 45.60s.
The second round consisted of 4 heats. Again only one athlete broke 45s – Alvin Harrison ran 44.25.
14 of the 16 qualifiers to the semi finals were sub 45.50s, with the slowest qualifier at 45.55 and the average time 45.25. The first 4 only in each heat advanced to the semis with no fastest losers. This meant that Miloza with 45.52s missed the next round after running 5th in his semi.
The semi finals turned out an embarrassing lop sided event causing Avard Moncur to miss despite running the 5th fastest time of the semis. Moncur ran 5th in the first semi in 45.18s. The winner of the second semi was Pettigrew with 45.24. In the semis three runners ran sub 45.0s, again – Harrison, Michael Johnson and Greg Houghton. The average time of the 8 runners to advance was 45.12s with the slowest at 45.53.
Overall there were only 8 sub 45s times recorded in Sydney, with four of them run by Alvin Harrison.
Only two athletes actually improved with every round:
- Michael Johnson - 45.25, 45.31, 44.65, 43.84.
- Alvin Harrison – 44.96, 44.25, 44.53, 44.40.
[b]3. Greg Houghton – 45.63, 45.08, 44.93, 44.70. - Sanderli Parrela – 45.55, 45.55, 45.17, 45.01.[/b]
- Robert Mackowiak – 45.39, 45.01, 45.53, 45.14.
- Hendrick Monganyetsi – 45.22, 45.15, 45.52, 45.26.
- Antonio Pettigrew – 45.62, 45.35, 45.24, 45.42.
- Danny MacFarlane – 45.84, 45.40, 45.38, 45.35.
Interestingly Avard Moncur ran 45.23, 45.43, 45.18 and missed out.
In Athens 2004, there were 8 first round heats.
The fastest time of the eight heats was Chris Brown with 45.09. The average time of the 24 athletes who advanced to the semi finals was 45.46, with the slowest being 45.88. 14 athletes ran sub 45.50s. None broke 45.0s.
In the three semi finals, the average time of the 8 who advanced to the final was 45.03s. Fastest was Jeremy Wariner with 44.87s and the slowest qualifier ran 45.08s. 3 athletes broke 45.0s.
In the final, 5 athletes recorded PB’s with 7 athletes breaking 45.0s. Only Michael Blackwood failed to run sub 45s in the final. The average time of the final was 44.67s.
The first seven athletes improved with every round:
1. Jeremy Wariner – 45.56, 44.87, 44.00.
2. Otis Harris – 45.11, 44.99, 44.16.
3. Derrick Brew – 45.41, 45.05, 44.92.
4. Alleyne Francique – 45.32, 45.08, 44.66.
5. Brandon Simpson – 45.61, 44.97, 44.76.
6. Davian Clarke – 45.54, 45.27, 44.83.
7. Leslie Djhone – 45.40, 45.01, 44.94.
8. Michael Blackwood – 45.23, 45.00, 45.55.
Overall there were 10 sub 45.0s times.
In Beijing 2008 there were 7 heats of the men’s 400m.
As he did in 2004, Chris Brown recorded the fastest time in the first round in Beijing, running 44.79. The average time of the qualifiers to the semi finals was 45.19s. The slowest was 45.96 (automatic qualifier) with Kevin Borlee running 45.43 to be the slowest of the non-automatic qualifiers. 6 athletes ran sub 45.0s in the first round. (4 of them were in heat 2).
As in Athens there were 3 semi finals with the first two in each semi and next fastest two qualifying for the final. All 8 finalists ran sub 45.0s to qualify with Gary Kikaya running 44.94 to finish as 9th fastest, just missing the final. The fastest was Merritt with 44.12 and David Neville was the slowest of the 8 with 44.91. The average semi time of the 8 finalists was a slick 44.58.
LaShawn Merritt & David Neville were the only finalists to run faster with each run.
1. LaShawn Merritt – 44.96, 44.12, 43.75.
2. Jeremy Wariner – 45.23, 44.15, 44.74.
3. David Neville – 45.22, 44.91, 44.80.
4. Chris Brown – 44.79, 44.59, 44.84.
5. Leslie Djhone – 45.12, 44.79, 45.11.
6. Martyn Rooney – 45.00, 44.60, 45.12.
7. Renny Quow – 45.13, 44.82, 45.22.
8. Johan Wissman – 44.81, 44.64, 45.39.
Seven athletes ran PB’s in the heats and there were also seven PB’s recorded in the semis. Merritt was the only athlete to PB in the final.
I guess the obvous conclusion in comparing Sydney with its 4 rounds and the 3 rounds conducted at Athens and Beijing, is that athletes have to be ready to run hard and fast in the first round. The removal of one round has contributed to raising the standard with the number of sub 45s times increasing dramatically (8 in Sydney compared to 19 in Beijing). Bear in mind there were 16 races in Sydney compared to 11 races in Beijing. In Athens & Beijing, certainly athletes needed to be close to season’s or personal best shape to advance from the first round.
Probably the most significant stat is: The average time to qualify from the 4 heats of the second round in Sydney was 45.25 compared to 45.19 fro the first round in Beijing (7 heats).
In the two semis in Sydney, the average time of the 8 finalists was 45.12 compared to Athens – 45.03 and Beijing 44.58.
That probably suggests the overall quality of running through the initial rounds to make the final is higher now with 3 rounds than it was with 4 rounds.
Thank you! An excellent analysis of the situation. Yes, it is necessary to be ready from round one now but it should lead to better overall performances. Conditions in the Beijing final were less than optimal, as confirmed by observation and overall performance.
Does this information lead us to conclude that any change is required in overall preparation or only in meet preparation/taper?
It was suggested that the rest day before the final might allow DOMS to set in. This is a valid question. What do you think? What could be done on the rest day to avoid it?
I would be very interested to hear what MJ thinks of this current structure. I strongly suspect he’d feel it would help him in particular.
Before the final, MJ (commentating on BBC) mentioned that the athletes had a day of rest and should thus be ready to perform well. Afterwards he stated that he had no idea why almost everyone (especially Wariner) ran so much slower in the final than in the semifinals.
I don’t think the conditions were particularly bad. As mentioned, there were never any strong winds in the Birds nest and it had stopped raining a while before the final.
Athens had the same programme (including rest day) as Beijing, but none of the athletes had to run a PB or SB to make it to the final.
Thanks Youngy. All the facts and a tidy and accurate summation. Thanks for writing up a report which must have taken ages to prepare. Now we all know the ground-rules and the changes involved in 400m tournament racing as it is today.
Excuse me, but what is DOMS? Ive missed that definition somewhere along the way. :o
Delayed Onset Muscle Soreness.
Thanks. I think that will be a factor to a greater or lesser degree, but there are probably issues relating to specific preparation dealing with 400m Racing, which I suspect are bigger contributors.
We all know that you need a bunch of hard races to get Race-Fit for competition, probably in any event, but certainly in the 400m.
I remember going into the Seoul 400m final - after a day’s rest (DOMS?) - and asking my guy how he feels (as we met before he warmed up. He bent over the touch his toes and his hands reached just down to his knees and no further. I knew he was cactus there and then, despite looking pretty easy in his 44.3 semi. But he still ran mid-44s in the final despite being loaded up in the hammies.
Now the reason I’m mentioning that is because we took our own masseur, put him up in an apartment at a five-star hotel in Seoul where my guy and his mates could chill out away from the noisy athletes’ village, and get treated every few hours if needed.
In addition, we were thorough warming up and warming down with each round, took plenty of water etc.
But he had only had a handful of “races” during 1988 (due to a nagging hammy problem - calcification in tissue near or adhering to the sciatic nerve sheath, which Charlie helped identify, massage and remedy six weeks prior to the OGs).
And none of those races were sub-46. Yet he opened the first of four rounds in 45.9 (a season PB) and then ran three rounds in 44s). I think the missing ingredient in that 1988 single periodised preparation was simply hard and fast racing.
I don’t really think it was DOMS so much, but short of having taken a biopsy at the time I can’t say for sure.
I’ve been thinking all along ever since then that the reason he did so comparatively well at those Games was because of the concurrent style of training development during that year (apart from him being a mighty competitor and a super talent). The thing that was a feature of that concurrent system was the quite high-level anaerobic threshhold sets often targeting race-splits for a low 44sec 400m.
What was missing was specific speed-endurance, perhaps backed up on itself - such as a simulation of rounds over a few consecutive days. No other athletes get that SSE preparation like the Americans who go sudden-death round after round in the US Trials. It’s the Olympics you have when you’re getting ready for the Olympics. The US athletes have already had their Olympics because the standard is so high.
Therefore maybe that SSE needs further development and a higher order of priority, perhaps cycling in and out, during the annual preparation, especially now that the majors have just three hot rounds.