Lactate Threshold Training

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1881

PS : The races should help you decide what you need in training as you progress through your season. If you lack “speed” then do some more speed-type training and make sure you are properly rested before each high intensity session.

If you cannot finish your races, then make sure you keep some endurance training in your program. There are many examples of speed and endurance sets even in the GPP. Just take those and play around with them a bit, make them specific to your racing needs.
Just to be sure, do you mean modify next seasons training considering my limitations this year?

NO, ACT NOW. Every race or time trial should yield information. Use the information to adjust your training to address the shortcomings revealed by your most recent performances .

1882

Thanks :wink:

I am interested in this concept. I (or my coaches) have usually focused only in increase the quality of the runs decreasing the volume without taking that much into account the last performances.

In my case, I am feeling pretty fast (2.8x in flying 30 and 6.6x in 60m standing), the problems I have felt during my races are:

  • Bad start.
  • Crossing legs: some cuts&blood on the calves.
  • Last 50 meters on the 200.
  • Slow start on the 400 (first 200m) and the last 80m (I guess that’s normal).

I am not sure how I would address this; I am writing my reasoning: as I am competing on Saturday, I thought on 2 days:

Monday: 4x80m (starting from blocks, 400m pace). 4x150.
Wednesday: 4x100m, 2x(200+200).

Tempo on Tuesday and warm-up on Friday.

Does the reasoning makes sense? If not, where is the mistake and what/why would you change? Thanks! :wink:

1883

Legs crossing? Could be a weakness to semimembranosis (or adductor) unable to stablise the leg when trailing in the stride recovery cycle. See you physiotherapist.

Your proposed work for this week sounds ok to me. Only one way to find out. Try it. If you run real fast, note it down for future reference.

1884

Wow! Thanks, I will definitely check the adductor. I have had this problem since I can remember and nobody could tell me why, so it could be nice to stabilize the stride. Could it be that the rest of the hamstring muscles are stronger that the adductor and this affects the stride? I am asking this question because I’ve always had pretty strong hamstrings (in eccentric exercise with some inclination I can block my body few centimeters from the ground with not that much effort).

Also, another question: how do you address weights workouts during competition time?

1885

Weights during comp. I keep them as far away from the next race or speed training session as possible. If we have a race on Saturday, we will do weights maybe Monday after the Monday track session, then Tues is usually a rest day, Wednesday is back to high intensity on track and followed then by weights same day. So during comp period we drop back to one or two weights sessions a week if there is a race at the end of the week. But we will sometimes deliberately schedule a block of training and skip some meets so we can reload in the gym if needs be. The “needs be” is based on the observations/feelings of both the athlete and the coach.

1886

Update!!

Today was huge day. My 400m boy ran a 48.93 then 25 minutes later ran a 22.6 200m. He ran against a quality runner in both events and it was the closest races of the year for him. He broke the school record (one of his goals) and now has until May 20 to prep for the regional meet, which decides who makes the state finals.

The plan is tomorrow massage and recovery jog. Thursday maybe tempo of 300s. Friday a warm-up only.

We have a high quality meet Saturday. He will run the 4x800, 400 open, and 4 x 400 and possibly a 4x200 relay. All the events will be close to hour time between. He is a 2:05 800 relay leg and our 4x800 team is top 4 in area, with the other 3 teams being there Saturday.

Sunday would be massage and recovery jog.
Monday was planning on 200+200.
Tuesday maybe 4x200 in come home pace.
Wednesday tempo again,
Thursday warm up.
Friday: Race Day

He seems to do well with recovery jogs of 15-20 minutes the day before our Tuesday meets and a few of the Saturdays. I might give Wednesday off, then Thursday 15 min jog. Friday race day.

We have been 2 weeks since doing any speed work. Our last speed session was 2 weeks ago Thursday and we did 60, 80, 120, 150, 250 with full recovery. Followed by recovery jog on Friday then Meet Saturday (ran well: 4x200 leg, 4x100 leg, 4x400 leg, all fast or him)

Last week we did Mon jog, Tues Meet, Wed 6x200 with jog recovery in come home pace, Thursday jog, Friday off, Sat meet (ran crappy). Sun off
Monday jog 20 min, Meet (today, set 2 PRs).

Any tips leading to the regional meet in abut 9 days??

Thanks again. He, and I both thank you.

1887

Congratulations! This shows a huge improvement after the first races!

Related to the next races, isn’t it too much?

1888

Is individual top performance a single event happening in a certain moment in time (towards which we strive hard to manage all information to us available) or more so a state which allows for individual best performances possibly in a row and over (at least some of the) time?

1889

You seem to ‘agree’ with Clyde Hart and Michael Johnson (and others, I guess), who don’t believe in tapering as such? Am I reading you correctly?

1890

I guess you are. Aristotle seems to tell the whole story in your signature:how does a habit ever need a taper?

1891

I have a few questions then :slight_smile:
What does the duration of this high performance period depend upon? Do the characteristics needed for such a performance determine the time frame to get ready for (e.g., the shorter the event, the more cycles within a season)?
And how can we be sure this series of high performances (i.e., without tapering) are at least as good, if not better (that’s always the target, no?) vs. the individual top one ‘when it matters most’ (after tapering)?
In other words, a habit may not need tapering, but will it equal top performance (excellence) ‘simply’ by what is done repeatedly? I wish I could ask Aristotle… :slight_smile:

*shall we move this to a separate thread perhaps?

1892

see I don’t get this concept of no taper. If we take it literally it means an athlete is ready to run at their best at any given time almost at the drop of a hat. Hart says he moves from quantity to quality, if that isn’t a taper then what is? Unless of course what is meant by no taper is over a much shorter period in season i.e. no special 10 day (or other) phase pre major meet ala CF. So the volume and type of Wariner does in the week leading into the WC will be the same as 2 months out? Really?

1893

Some systems of training more or less keep the athlete fresh year round, by never really loading them up in the classic ways (i.e. 3 hard/1 easy). Along with that realize that tapering only adds a few percentage points to performance. And that’s only if it’s allowing built up fatigue to dissipate. Don’t build up a bunch of fatigue in the first place and tapering may become more or less moot.

1894

Upon the duration of the high performance training inducing the deficit.

Not at all.

Maybe the real question is what prevents in most if not all training programs excellence from being a habit,and along with it top performance,day in,day out.

1895

I don’t think such high performances can be accomplished year round. But they seem to be achieved more or less once the season starts and during it. I guess, the “racing-reloading” cycle, as KitKat has mentioned many times, plus the competitive edge, as the season progresses, would result in higher and higher performances almost by default. Having said that, I would too expect at least some differences of, say, volume, during the season. I would like to read KitKat’s comment on this issue and his experiences.

1896

Aren’t these few percentage points though worth trying for? Or you mean it’s not worth the ‘risk’, if a ‘non-loading’ system is followed (i.e., a more conservative approach)?

1897
  1. Agreed.
  2. I partly agree, i.e., it’s not necessary for a short sprinter to compete during February, for example (although Charlie insisted on Powell racing more earlier on, if I remember correctly), but would it be prudent for, say, a marathoner to systematically run more than 2 marathons each season year in, year out? I.e., to reverse it, the longer the event, the fewer cycles, no? And the longer it takes to get ready for?
  3. Perhaps striking the balance between proper recovery (to put it loosely) and specific enough stimuli. And human resistance, of course, to pursue such a route with a free mind. :slight_smile:
1898

Do some balance drills one foot either side of the line.

1899

Great man.
Hopefully all others of your squad will improve the same way…

just had y fist meet…
300m, a complete shutdown @240m…
that did hurt…
So I think i will consider it a good training…
some new chances next week…

1900

Today had last meet before regionals this Friday. He ran a 2:02 4x800 split. 4 x 200 leg was ok but not as good as Tuesday. Open 400 was bad. Neck tightening caused chest cramp. Ran 51.4. Later ran 4 x 4 leg in easy 50.5…no cramp that time.

Its interesting he runs a good 800 considering all training distances we’re under 300.