1.“Back up” days? I do not get what you mean here. The doubles are used to build cardiac and general fitness! I do not have an exhaustive picture of their placement in time,and I was only able to reconstruct possible progressions from the info I gathered myself. For sure the doubles are abandoned in favor of singles only as condition of the athletes progresses and leading to a peak.
2.In my opinion the work vs. rest blocks configuration of the model,the durations of these blocks,and their distribution and progression in time are interesting parameters,possibly shading new light on our body’s adaptability patterns.
3.Again I am not sure of what you mean here,as I do not see any need to seek “universality” or “perfection” as qualities of an existant and codified training system .
I would view it more as a source of information,to be analysed,processed,and made productive of further information
yea, and now he’s in jail (from wednesday) till friday, possible use and probably also import & dealing of doping (they wont put someone here in jail only for the ‘possible’ use) funny to mention when he told about the revolutonary training method (6*100 full efort/day every day) that other famous athletes also used it: kenteris & montgomery. Maybe he wanted to mention something else or the revolutionary greek training program is highly not wada certified?? But here i’ll stop with the forbidden topic on this forum.
OK, thanks for these!
With my last point I was just trying to figure out where you stop with such a programme (e.g., to power events only).
But from your saying you take it as it is, fair enough.
he claimed this on national tv here (mind the claiming part, he had a ‘little’ ego so comparing his methods with other great sprinters isnt strange for him )
I have a very very very very hard time believing montgomery did what you describe, considering CF was managing his workouts when he set the WR! If you have info, great.
He is pretty naturally fast–9.96 @ 19 w/ minimal training.
In a tape from I think 4-5 years ago, Ivan abadjev stated that some greek sprinters (namenly Thanou) employed a bulgarian method adapted for track, that is reaching daily max, no real periodization and stressing the body to adaptation
Reading through the threads in this Forum too,I seem to notice a general hidden trend of information and discussions over time moving from a more rigid “periodization” concept and the derived different models to a softer,less rigid and defined training concept and model in dynamic accordance to the body’s adaptation capacity.
One of the interesting points of the Greek (or Bulgarian) training model is its extreme simplicity and linearity,with the options of stimulation limited by design in name of extreme specificity,and great importance and attention given to the management and modulation of variable exposition to the very same set of specific stimuli.
Finally recognizing the very istantaneous reality of our organism…
In any training program dont forget to take in account what is done during warm up and warm down, and usually it contains (enough?) low intensity. BTW i ve seen them doing reps of 300m tempo on the grass, or jogs with precise technical points to work, core work, etc…
Note that while the Greek NR are 6.51 for 60m indoors and 19.85 for 200m, which indicates sub10 for 100m, the NR is only 10.11… Check their all time lists and you will see their problem at 100m.
I deeply share your thought and insight about warm up/down and technical contents as possible low intensity balancing tools.
Critically important analysis of the 100m subpar performances produced:what are your considerations in this regard in relation to their supposed training modalities?
Note that while the Greek NR are 6.51 for 60m indoors and 19.85 for 200m, which indicates sub10 for 100m, the NR is only 10.11… Check their all time lists and you will see their problem at 100m.
greeks have a problem with speed training in general. I have seen how the average greek coach works (im greek) and it aint prety. Tzekos is a prety damn good coach and from what i have gathered (im unlucky enough to live quite far away from where kenteris is training…) he trains i way principaly similar to the CF methods though with a touch of bulgarian training.
I know that tzekos group would often train 6-8 hours a day warming up 3-4 times in that time, perfoming just one 200m rep and some lifts, then rest for a couple of hours and repeat.
Kenteris was probably sub 10 in the 100 but he didnt have the time to prove it after the drug scandal blew off in the athens olympics. Essentially he got f’ed in the A.
The speed problem though is generalized, greek coached dont properly grasp the meaning of CNS stress. They thing that because a rep of 20m speed feels easyer than 200m then it is. They actually use solely plyometric days as a means of rest. Go figure.
Kenteris was an exception, the average greek championship times at the 100m is 10.8, go figure. I would go as far to say that there is no “greek” school just a couple of briliant coaches that managed to survive the way greeks think. Its how we do everything here sadly…
I really doubt Kemteris was able to run under 10sec even in 2002, his bend was not something fantastic 10.3x, while MJ was 10.12.
I would refer to the men only, or the ability to reach top speed close to 12m/s. The Greek women showed enough top speed to run 10.83 and 11.03. At this stage, men and women are different, maybe Greek training works better for women than for men, look at Bulgarian 100m all time lists women are far better than men.
This said, for men 100m, i see that too high knee lift, too long ground contact, lack of relaxation are the visible effects. As for the cause its always difficult to assess when you are only oberver and dont know the full story.
Check the latest form the Nationals -not brilliant, but not 10.8 either…
i briefly saw a small international meet like two weeks ago, none of the “big” names like xoidas or what have you where there but the average time was there 10.7-10.8 and the best from a greek sprinter was 10.4 i think…
i could be wrong though
As for the cause its always difficult to assess when you are only oberver and dont know the full story.
you are probably right, im not that into things to know. But dont judge from the good ones, the ones you see in meets etc, the ones i have contact with are the mediocre athletes and they are sub par with say the american equals. It has alot to do with the state of track and field in greece though, its prety far behind in terms of funds etc…
eastern european countries have always been good at producing female sprinters, not male.
Why is that?
In the case of DDR different training modalities (horst hilla for women), for others, well, have no idea.(worth noting that female athletes are more “sensible” in certain areas…
But it doesn’t expalain the whole thing.
WE can also suggest that maybe track for female is more attractive than for male, so they gather up better talent.
About training, we know there are diferent biomechanical traits btwn male and female.
We could maybe open a thread in which we can speculate different training protocols for men versus women.
What do you mean by “sub-optimal state”, pakewi? As in “tired” etc?
From what I know this is an important part of the problem, but also rather lack of paying attention to important details (e.g., running relaxed, as PJ said), or how to bring this up and this isn’t there in young athletes either.
)