What is the freq and intensity for the squat in MS? With the sprint program I don’t see much difference btw lsu and cfts.
During SPP, my skill guys will squat anywhere from 1, 2, or 3, times per week. It depends on their time in the program, position on the depth chart, and personal preference.
The differences I’m referring to between the LSU weight training example and CFTS is comparing the SPP weight/resistance training:
LSU
- rep jerks
- snatch
- quarter squats
- C&J
- bench
- deep squats
- power clean
- hang clean
- clean shrug
- deadlifts
- hang snatch
- single leg squats
- speed squats
to
CFTS
- bench/incline
- half squat
- lat pull down/arm pulls
- reverse leg press
- partner reverse hyper
- push ups
- and maybe a clean variant if they have the skill
Based upon the frightening appearance of the mechanics illustrated in the LSU football training video, I’m equally as concerned about what the lift mechanics must look like for the track athletes.
My question was for the Max strength phase?
Watch this vid, around 345.
Yup, video confirmed my concern.
Horrifying technique:
- reverse curl masquerading as a clean
- valgus knee stress when squatting (can just make it out by looking at the Q angle)
- excessive anterior knee shift when catching the ‘reverse curl’
(also note the female in the background- frightening anterior knee shift, reverse curl…atrocious)
The thing is, Buddy and I are very critical of the mechanical execution of the lifts during weight training.
The only exceptions you’ll see, in some cases, is the ass coming off the bench when straining maximally during a bench press; however, this poses no orthopedic concern; unlike the valgus stressing at the knees and anterior knee shift we see in all of the LSU weight training footage.
It’s truly irresponsible and wrong to see this happening in the videos and the coaches are standing right there completely oblivious to what’s happening in front of their eyes.
I welcome any of the readers here to visit our program (so long as you are not affiliated with any of our competitors) and you’ll learn how to properly coach an athlete in order that they demonstrate mechanical efficiency in weight training, jumping, throwing, sprinting, and so on.
Despite your objections, I’m sure that you would agree that this technique is most certainly the rule rather than the exception when talking about most college weight rooms. From what I have seen from the LSU video and the program on paper, it seems as though the weight program is structured more like a GS or BB circuit for conditioning and/or recovery than it is for developing power or strength. Presumably the bulk of the adaptations occur from the sprinting, jumping and throwing of med balls.
Some similarities…
CFTS has also power clean options…and half squats, are parallel or below, not 90 degrees
Thats LoLo Jones in the background!
Incidently, Bompa himself uses the conversion weights we speak of during his periodisation. This is also why Dave Leese uses them… after speaking with Tudor Bompa. Dave reckoned that Jason Gardener ran slower when his clean strength peaked… but when they dropped the weight… sub-10!
No question, which is why it’s all that more troubling to me because these are very easy problems to rectify and in some cases may be resolved in a single training session.
Based upon the video alone I would agree with you as the loads they are lifting are so small that the forces generated would be insignificant; regardless how fast they move the barbell.
Eros, a half squat is characterized by 90 degrees of knee flexion; thus the crease in the hips are always above parallel when performing a half squat.
In order of depth of the hips/degree of knee flexion, this is the sequence (highest to deepest)
- 1/4 squat
- 1/2 squat
- parallel squat
- Olympic squat
Amazing that a coach working with a world class athlete would be in a position to make such a pedestrian revelation.
News flash to coaches, with respect to CNS intensive activities that tax the same musculature, the more you do over here the less you can do over there.
This is a little off the topic, but i was wondering if anyone here has completed any of the certifications at Tudor Bompa Institute (tudorbompa.net), and if so, would you recommend them?
My friend Carlo Buzzichelli is one of the institute heads in Italy.
http://www.tudorbompa.net/c.buzzichelli.html
If you do not have success with the contact information listed there you can message me privately.
Thank you!
I got PPS…in Italy ( the first after Carlo)…feel free to contact me through pm.
OK, so you DO have max strength; It’s just not at the same time as SPP for the primary activity. This sounds similiar to what I have with Russian PL methodology, where there is a primary load peak before SPP, the weight load is cut sharply during the main part of SPP, then cycles up again (more weight than before, but ~75% fewer reps) as the track volume comes off. The Russians actually do this to carefully program the supercompensation phase, but it has the advantage of carefully balancing weight load versus training load for the primary activity.
I would probably tend to agree with you; however, it’s really a matter of programming. If the squat is a staple in the plan than it should stick around. Alternatively, if the mindset is more ‘global’, if you will, as far as thinking hip/leg extension strengthening then more than one means may be used in a block system.
If you accept Charlie’s philosophy of track strength preceding weights, then it might seem logical to sharply reduce or eliminate squats during the period in SPP where there is track volume of enough intensity to provide the stimulus–and then as the track load goes down, the squats might be cycled appropriately to maintain the stimulus.
[/quote]
Yup. While there’s no taking away from the success of the T&F program it’s not at all how I would do things; however, this probably does not come at any surprise to you.
If I were programming the training of sprinters you would see far more of a CFTS influence in so far as a ‘generalist’ approach to the ‘strength training’.
You have to be very careful mixing approaches, something I learned whe I started training with John Smith part of the time a couple of years ago.
LSU has a VERY high intensity track approach that emphasizes contrast training as the primary track workout. This is not just overspeed (part of the season) but maybe the most risky training method ever invented short of doing depth jumps off a skyscraper. BUT…it works, and even if you get injured, you still get faster (everyone I know who has used this has gotten faster, although the occasional injury rate is seems to be at least 50%).
Because of the extreme stress (hamstrings particularly) of this one track workout, LSU may need the very light weight loads you see pictured in the videos.
I found the training microcycle interesting because:
(a) They’re actually doing contrast training in November already, even though they’re not doing the overspeed part yet.
(b) They’re following this workout with essentially 4 days of recovery (including the weekend off).
Tamfb: If you have any more specific training phase info (preferably closer to comp) from Dennis Shaver, I’d love to see it.
Correct. I actually outline my annual programming in a seminar I recently lectured at in New Jersey. This will be available on DVD for anyone interested.
The Russian approach you’ve mentioned makes the most sense to me regarding the T&F disciplines that are more closely linked to special strength preparation in the technical/tactical sense such as the jumps and throws; while I am more drawn to CFTS with respect to sprints/hurdles.
Agreed, although I would tend to keep it around just enough to maintain smoothness when the aspect of the load, represented by the squat, picks back up. This is where my choice of sub-maximal weight training comes into play (enough to retain yet low enough not to compete)
No question. In order for this to work it is the principles of varied approaches, or even the spirit which inspired those principles, that may effectively be aggregated with other principles/spirits into a highly effective working model.
This is essentially what I have done for my American footballers as I am heavily influenced by Charlie as well as the Soviets so to this I’ve added my own original thinking into my own working model that is, in my opinion, very well thought out and practical.
Surprising to me that such as high cost approach would be used; especially considering the talent pool they routinely have to work with.
It’s curious to me that the approach would not be simplified in order to allow the genetically gifted to be nurtured as opposed to playing Russian Roulette.
That stands to reason; although their lifting form is, and I do not believe that this is even open for debate, entirely unacceptable.
Can you explain the contrast training other than overspeed work?
I guess you can do that stuff when you have the power to recruit (and get) almost anybody that you want.
lkh give us a break down about the Russian PL program, I still think dropping squats is not a good idea.
This is the contrast training thing:
26:50 Contrast Training: Aim is to fool the nervous system into performing at a higher level.
Resistance: Running Against the Wind; Hills (1% uphill gradients); Weighted Vests,
Tyre Towing. Resistance must be <10% (such that concentration can be on technique,
not the resistance.Assistance: Ultra Speed Pacer; Running with the Wind; Downhill (1%).
32:00 Implementing Contrast Training
Resistance Sprints: 3 x 30m (accel. 15-25m); timed. 2-5 min. recoveries
3 x Assisted Sprints (30m); timed.
2-5 min. recoveries3 x Normal … the real sensation.
Charlie, PJ, John Smith, and Franno, among others, won’t want any part of this. But Shaver’s results (and this training method originally came from Loren, and it is NOT new) speak for itself. It is a very powerful training method–IF you can SURVIVE the workout.
I cut the volume down by 30-50%, but still, if you try to do anything of even moderate stress 2 days later, I guarantee you WILL injure your hamstring. And, as you can see from the example microcycle, they don’t seem to do any “sprint training” for several days.
No way are you going to do SQ, DL, PC of any intensity that sprinters are normally familiar with for several days and survive with your hamstrings “in normal working condition as supplied by the manufacturer.”
How about dropping squats during peak competition periods? Just cleans + bench alone should be enough stimulus from the weight room.