Alright, so I assume that because of the higher CNS and muscular involvement in deadlifts the supercompensation is probably higher. So I’m thinking, since for a developing athlete improving general fitness and specific work capacity as well as postural and technical work are of a special importance special/speed endurance can be very important and probably should be used extensively even during Max Strengh. So this athlete (who bares a remarkable resemblance to me) might benefit from splitting three hard days in a week as heavy CNS/heavy muscular (accel.+top speed development + squats as leg exercise in the weightroom) very heavy CNS/heavy muscular (accel.+top speed development + deadlifts as leg exercise in the weightroom) and moderate CNS/very heavy muscular (special/speed endurance and no weights, since its not used near comp probably less time doing this setup with speed endurance). The deadlifts should allow a high CNS compensation past the special/speed endurance day. I assume the weekly setup could go squat day, special/speed endurance day, deadlift day. Thoughts on this?
I agree with you DAZED the power developed at top speed is in the extended to hyperextended range of motion in the hip. For this reason I use the loaded hyperextension to train this range and the squat to develop the bent knee and flexed hip position power required in the early accelleration phase.
This is why Olympic lifts are popular: Compensatory acceleration and mild hyper extention occur.
However, whilst the training effect is greatest at the angle (range) trained, it crosses over to all other angles.
i fear olympic lifts more. i always find there’s more room for me to hurt myself through poor technique in an OL. Plus, being well over 6 foot, hoiking the weight all that way up just, to me, invites danger. maybe im just making excuses for not doing them. :rolleyes:
deadlifts i’d much rather. there is the power/speed argument, but hasnt it also been argued that the speed differential between sprinting and even ‘fast’ power weights like OLs is still a large difference anyway?
Horses for courses. Deadlifts work my back and hamstrings without wrenching it.
"there is the power/speed argument, but hasnt it also been argued that the speed differential between sprinting and even ‘fast’ power weights like OLs is still a large difference anyway? "
One of the main reason O-lifts are used are they recruit more motor units, thus a wide variety of muscles can be worked in a short amount of time.
It seems many people prefer “specific” exercises in a general program too. Is this a matter of finding what works for you and sticking with it or is it a way of smuggling a specific exercise through the backdoor?
Squats, oly lifts, and deads work the hams at the hip but is it not more important to work them from the knee at the same time ie. as in reverse leg press (slight knee bend) or similar?
In sprinting, the way I see it, the hams contract both at the hip and knee at the same time on 2 occasions during the leg cycle; at the end of the swing phase (after 20m), and at the start of the support phase (latter half of the acceleration phase anyway); which is very important since it develops the power to overcome the initial (and greatest) resistance against propulsion. Further into the support phase they then contract only at the hip. Is this correct?
From personal experience my ham pulls have always been at the point in the muscle which is hardly recruited using squats, oly lifts or deads ie. the lower half of the hams. I know this since I have been able to train these execises after such pulls. Also, at the time of the pulls I had never trained reverse leg press or similar, only the above exercises, therefore a weakness in the areas. BTW reverse leg press (slight knee bend) was not possible after the pulls. Also, ham curls (working the lower ham moreso) were possible, which shows that there are areas of the muscle that are not recruited sufficiently for strengthening without contracting the muscle at the hip and knee together.
This is not to say squats, deads, and olys are not beneficial for the hams, but I feel there is a missing link if they are the only ham exercises trained. These exercises are often performed for other reasons than just strengthening the hams anyway, but I would place reverse leg press (slight knee bend) as the most important exercise for the hams. Any comments?