While clearly unconscious to them at the time, no doubt this was likely the most self limiting decision of their professional careers.
A fact that if remedied would likely improve the state of western sport training and physical education, personal training, physical therapy, athletic training, and wellness training- exponentially.
Indeed, an understatement.
Ange,
It was Ian and CP. It got to the point that some of CP’s main followers were trashing Ian right and left when he had seminars set up, trying to ruin attendance. Of course, you know Ian held himself above it all. I know Ian loved Charlie; he told me in Toronto that he was brilliant way back in 3 day. Perhaps that is why I sat and asked so many questions over dinner that night. Ian and Charlie have different delivery and different styles, but both are extraordinary men. Nobody who knew Charlie on a personal level ever had anything but love and respect for him. Next time I am in Toronto, I will buzz you and maybe we can hook up for a tea or something. Got enough Tim’s and Starbucks over there. Haha.
I hope my comments were not miscontrued. I guess I was saying that Charlie had a different way of communicating. I loved his seminars. They were insightful, colorful, and funny. I loved learning from him and I loved sitting talking to him after sessions on many different subjects. He was easily one of the 2-3 smartest people I have met in my lifetime. The people who walked out of SWIS are short sighted fools. I saw a certain coach who ranted on drivel for the full session plus and the room was packed. If people don’t appreciate Charlie, they didn’t deserve his knowledge. Charlie had a mind that I wish I had one tenth of. Sheer brilliance, beautiful person, and excellent coach. He is the standard in this industry for going the extra mile for his athletes. True commitment.
I have most of Ian’s courses and books related to physical prep and coaching and have always been a big admirer of his. I haven’t met him in person but I did talk to him on the phone when he hosted a conference call with Charlie back in 2002 for people who had purchased tapes of a seminar he did with Charlie. I found him to be very easy going and laid back.
Ian definitely has his own approach, but when you understand the overall structure of how he does things and how everything fits together you really see Charlie’s influence. Like Charlie, Ian places a lot of emphasis on looking at the overall load the athlete is performing (not just strength training) and how the components of training interact. As a result, he often de-emphasizes strength development for other priorities (he’s a fanatic about stretching) and typically advocates very modest volumes of strength work to keep the overall workload manageable. If you study Charlie’s and Ian’s respective materials you can tell they are very much on the same wavelength in terms of training philosophy, adapted to their respective experiences and clients.
Poliquin is another matter. I went to a seminar he gave in March 2000 on strength training for speed development. Based on what I learned at that seminar and all of the other material of his I’ve read over the years I would say that Poliquin is primarily (if not exclusively) focused on strength training. I know that sounds obvious, but you have to understand the implications of that when attempting to incorporate his methods into an overall program. As Charlie pointed out a couple years ago, most of Poliquin’s published material seems to apply to the context of a concentrated strength block performed during the off season when there is not much competing work from the sport itself. That makes sense when you consider that is probably his primary time of involvement with the athletes. I’m sure he does continuous follow up consulting throughout the season, but it’s subordinate to the sport and customized for the athlete. And you’ll probably never see that stuff published publicly. The point is, you have to be very careful when studying Poliquin’s methods and attempting to incorporate them into a program that might have other concurrent high intensity elements that Poliquin was not taking into account. In fairness, I think that is true of the majority of strength training literature.
After interacting with Charlie over the last eight years and having trained with him in person (briefly and not nearly as much as I would have liked), I am much less impressed with Poliquin than I was 15 years ago. Having said that, I’m always interested in Poliquin’s writings because he’s a smart guy and there are a lot of valuable nuggets in there, even if I’m not buying into the overall package.
That’s indicative of the industry - sorry state of affairs. A couple of years later Paul Chek presented and the conference hall was packed to the rafters for over 2 hours.
Charlie presented a superb no BS approach - his Q+A was outstanding. Conversely Chek filled the presentation with no substance, no experience…etc etc
Flash echoes my sentiments as I spent a fair amount of time with Poliquin back in the late 90’s-early 2000. Strength is a big focus with Charles, but he does show concern for organizing all things CNS, particularly the lower extremities, whether strength, power, or speed.
It is interesting to see that very few of his earlier disciples are still around or have pursued PICP certifications. I think they realized that the value was in the information and not having more letters to place after their names.
I’d be curious to hear what Charlie thought of Charles, in as polite a way as possible.
I’m sure spending time with him like that probably gave you the opportunity to see elements of Poliquin’s work that never make it into print for the general readership.
I’m curious to know what he was like personality wise. In my one encounter with him he came across as an arrogant jerk to be blunt. I’ve heard the same from many other people, but I’ve also heard that outside of a seminar setting he’s much more down to earth and pleasant to deal with.
Has Al Vermeil produced any training manuals or videos? I know of him, but to be honest I don’t know much about how he does things.
This prhaps was the seminar I was alluding to. My wife wanted to walk ou of the “dirt facts” talk, but the room was too full of Chekies. I could have summed it up in one sentence. The farmers don’t get paid enough to use proper mineral and nutrient replacement, so they just use NPK fertilizer, make food devoid of many important minerals. End of seminar. I honestly think Charlie knew how complicated vertical integration was for the masses to consume, so he would deliver it for people to be able to digest it. Ange said it best when she said most of the people didn’t understand enough to unlock Charlies info at SWIS so instead of trying to shift to a new way of thinking, they would just prefer to leave and stay in their comfortable little box. I always told Ange, every time I visited Charlie, I left feeling like he kept growing intellectually by leaps and bounds. I loved the challenge of trying to keep up, which was tough when you are dealing with a true genius.
Perform better sells or sold a video with a manual put out by AV. I posted a link on another AV thread here.
With an organised group ****** an outsider has little options other than to defend or retreat. When over 3/4 walk out after the presenter has been introduced I would call that organised.
Reminds me when my wife was setting the level 4 coaching exam by correspondance, the early comments written on her exams was “AAA excellent”", when it became obvious who she was related to things changed. She is currently setting uni, a double degree, credit and distinction so far so she is no dumbass.
I have never met Charlie Francis or read any of his material. Good luck Angie.
I haven’t been to one of his seminars in years but your assessment seems accurate. I did spend time in private seminars/restaurants and his demeanor is different. Just not sure why he needs to dial up the “arrogant jerk” in seminars. Funny guy actually.
[I was in seminar and he was funny thoug some might find it a little arrogant. He illustrated a point, 1 min later some guy asks a question like he hadn’t heard what Charles was saying, and he replied " Could you possible be more vague" the guy asked again and he said the same thing. I laughed because he was basically sayin " If you come to a seminar, listen, digest, then ask questions. I asked him 2 questions and he was forthright and earnest in reply. I think it is how you frame the question sometimes. I found it quite entertaining myself. Some might think he is a prick, but enjoy different types of speakers.QUOTE=ollie;238806]I haven’t been to one of his seminars in years but your assessment seems accurate. I did spend time in private seminars/restaurants and his demeanor is different. Just not sure why he needs to dial up the “arrogant jerk” in seminars. Funny guy actually.[/QUOTE]
I was at a family event yesterday.
Everyone minus my dad and Charlie were there
It was great except for I was working Saturday am and the 3 hours ride there in Charlie’s car ( fantastic S 55, AMG engine which is a dream ) was horrible. Could not see 5 feet in front of me for the rain. OMG. I got thru it and James and I really enjoyed Sarnia on the lake. ( I love the water)… oh and btw. my brother phil said wearing polarized glasses in this situations makes a huge difference! great! if only I knew)
Gosh Charlie would be so proud of what James and I have been up to.
We have been busy catching up James and I on life over the past oh… 20 years. CHarlie loved family mine and his but guess what?
Re building our lives or his life which happily was mine took a fair bit up of that 20 some odd years. ( i will move thru this, please bear with me and dont get up and leave)
so when I read the post under this Ian and Charlie spot about how disorganized Charlie was I had to laugh ( lol)
Speed Coach is a good guy but no offense …He has not one clue about the say 50 graghs I need to get out for all of you to enjoy.
Plus I met this hockey player who plays with Denver? ( Ryan.geez dont tell anyone but i think the team is pretty good) Anyway, he lived with my brother in Junior A days and was at the party ( His girl friend was lovely and not bad on the eyes;) . He is a perfect canidate to tell the story how Charlie’s training translates to NHL. ( whoops, he does’nt even know this yet)
For now its all talk, I"m pretty disorganized my self ( not really but buying myself a bit more time).
I hope all of you are loving the site.
A bit lonely hey since Charlie left?
Wow I miss him so much.
( anyone want me to post his car so you can see it? )
he ( yeah i mean Charlie) wants me to do it)
Ok.
tired of the bathing suit crap. so dull
gotta go wash it and get it up NOW
Ange,
Although I only attended 1 seminar I have seen the majority of the DVD’s and am a bit of a planaholic so know about being organized. Charlie never appeared disorganised to me, that was just his manner which combined with his great stories could appear to some that he was. There is a lot of recognition that stories are one of the most influential ways of passing on information and while he got sidetracked at times those bits contained some real gems and fed the interest regarding elite level sport people like me have.
Although the things you are suggesting sound fantastic don’t feel pressure to rush things through for people, take your time. This place, while different from what it was, will survive and evolve while hopefully retaining the same ethos and spirit that has always made it different and special.
Take care.
Don’t sweat it. You have a full plate with all that has been going on in your life. We aren’t going anywhere. I look forward to the graphs and the many gems I am sure are around from all of Charlie’s years of work. To validate what you said about hockey, I use Charlie’s style training with one of my hockey players and it goes against the grain of all that he is taught. Last year he was rated number 3 in USA for 95’s. He is projected 1st round OHL draft pick next year. Since he was 10 he has been doind bodyweight work with me and speed work, all based on Charlie’s style. Also, Ange, I am super disorganized. Seriously, at Ian’s seminar in Boston, one of the guys that was there said " To others you look disorganized, but you actually have an order to your chaos. I always found that funny and all to true. Haha.
How awesome is Ange.
Seems more worried about us leaving the Charliefrancis.com family than herself. You have two priorities in life now, James and yourself.
None of us have any right to expect something from you, and it is pretty clear a lot the forumites here know a bit and can lead discussions - although none of them have the ability of the Charlie.
Once again Ange you are awesome and thankyou for allowing us to be part of the family.
How awesome is Charlie’s car?
James and I are having a great fun in it.
driving the speed limit all the time for sure;)
( what is the speed limit?)
Last time I saw him he asked if I wanted to sit in it! It was too nice for me and declined. I could tell he was proud of it, and also the story of the deal he got for it! 
oh Esti… such a mistake you made…And imagine how disappointed Charlie would have been. Life is so short ya all.
And it is one thing to sit and an entirley other thing to
RIDE
Oh yeah…take me for a ride…
( i think that might be a line to a great song or it should be)