Al Vermeil and Ian King

With an organised group ****** an outsider has little options other than to defend or retreat. When over 3/4 walk out after the presenter has been introduced I would call that organised.

Reminds me when my wife was setting the level 4 coaching exam by correspondance, the early comments written on her exams was “AAA excellent”", when it became obvious who she was related to things changed. She is currently setting uni, a double degree, credit and distinction so far so she is no dumbass.

I have never met Charlie Francis or read any of his material. Good luck Angie.