This is Roman - he ran well under Tyrone.
Do the old guys do that routine?
From what I understood everyone did pretty much the same thing. If I remember correctly at the meets I only saw the older white guys running the 200-400 (indoors). It wouldn’t surprise me if they did something slightly different.
What does Bill collins weekly templates look like?
He seems to be knowledgeable and is obviously good himself.
This is taken from Bill Collins book " The Ageless Athletic Spirit"
He gives a 52 week program
Week 1
Mon 3 mile run
Tues weights
Wed 8 x 400 with 2 mins rest
Thurs weights
Fri 3 mile run
Sat and Sun rest
Week 10
Mon 6 x 800m with 6 mins rec
Tues weights
Wed 25 x 60 m of hills or stadium stairs
Thurs weights
Fri rest
Week 20
Mon 450,350,250,350 .8 mims rest between reps
Tues weights
Wed 6 x 220m with 6 mins rec
Thurs weights
Fri 6 x 80m with full rec
Sat and Sun rest
Week 30
Mon 4 x 400m with 8 mims rest between reps
Tues weights
Wed 6 x 80m with full rec
Thurs weights
Fri 4 x 450m with 10 mins rec
Sat and Sun
Week 40
Mon 450, 350, 250m with 8 mims rest between reps
Tues weights
Wed 3 x 300mwith full rec
Thurs weights
Fri 4 x 20m, 4 x 30m from blocks, This is the first block session of the year
Sat and Sun
Week 50
Mon 3 x 50m, 2 x100m, 2 x 150m rest as required between reps
Tues weights
Wed 2 x 300mwith 8 mins rec
Thurs weights
Fri 3 x400m, negative splitting each 200m, 10 mins rec
Sat and Sun Rest
Week 52
Mon 3 x 350m rest as required between reps
Tues weights
Wed 4 x 200mwith 6 mins rec
Thurs weights
Fri, Sat Sun Rest
This is obviously a classic long to short program, but this doesn’t seem to make much sense to me. with very little speed work and a large volume of work during the peaking weeks. You can’t doubt the success though as Bill Collins is a masters superstar.
I have no doubt if I did this program I would get faster (put in the hours and be consistent). No matter what program I do I would get results. Would it be a fun program to do - NO - would the reps look ugly - Yes. I do like he’s taking a good amount of rest btw reps. I wouldn’t be surprise if Chris got some good results from this type of program.
Mind over matter
Pete Mulholland meets up with Steve Peters and shares the ‘secrets’ of his success
There are not many athletes who could put aside 30 minutes during a training session for an interview, but that didn’t prove a problem for Dr. Steve Peters, as that amount of time coincided with his interval between repetitions.
Peters appears to have thrown all of the traditional sprint training manuals ‘out of the window’ with his speed-based sessions covering a maximum of 1200m — and that includes his warm-up.
A signal failure at Lichfield meant that this writer missed out witnessing his warm-up for the session at the chilly surroundings of the Longford Park track in Stretford; home of Trafford AC.
A 400m jog — “anything over 400 and I would need oxygen,” admits Peters — followed by 10 minutes of stretching and a few leg lifts is deemed to be sufficient preparation for 4x100m intervals; each one increasing in speed. “I consider the intervals in of the session as the real warm-up,” he confesses.
The initial 100m today was timed at 15sec with the final effort taking just 11.7sec.before a break of 30 minutes takes place. “That wasn’t so good, as I ran 11.4 in the session last week” said Peters.
The final part of the session is a hard run over 300m or 400m. “This is not fixed as weather conditions and fitness levels play their part in the distance chosen.”
Be it 300m or 400m, each 100m segment is timed, with today’s 400m showing splits of 12.8sec, 13.8sec, 14.3sec and 15.2sec.
“I often run what I call kamikaze 300s where I go flat out for 100m and 200m and hanging in.” Peters explains. “I aim to get down to 36 (seconds) before moving up to 400m when I ease down by two seconds. I can then pass 300m in 38sec feeling relatively fresh.”
MINIMUM TRAINING PAYS DIVIDENDS
Sessions similar to this one take place three times each week with time spent actually running, being between three and six minutes every week. “I know it sounds bizarre but it works for me,” says Peters. “It develops the fast twitch fibres and it’s also quality not quantity that matters.”
Peters is willing to share the methods that has led him to arguably being the finest exponent of sprinting on the current masters’ scene, with a personal haul of national and international titles and records credited to him, if proof of this be needed.
Previous to his fall on the bend of the Lee Valley track at the British Masters Indoor Championships earlier this year; Peters had an unbeaten record stretching back to the World Masters at Brisbane in 2001, when calf problems were incurred.
The sole training partner with Peters today is Francis Scott, although at times anyone of seven athletes may take part in the session. Living close by to the Stretford track, the Trafford AC Life Member is just one athlete taking advantage of what Peters has to offer in terms of advice.
Scott won M40 silver at the 1999 World Championships in Gateshead, but since those days has incurred major illness problems.
“I won two European relay gold medals at Poznan,” says Scott, “but I’ve been told since, that relay medals are rubbish!”
It was at Poznan that Scott first met up with Peters and since then has seen a vast improvement both in training and competition. “Let’s just learn to do it (sprinting),” was Peters opening proposition.
And that is just what Scott has been doing, not only in how to train but also the mental side of competition.
“Now, instead of running around like a headless chicken before races,” admits Scott, “we (Peters) discuss race strategies. I now have a different mindset going into competition. What has been done in training tells me what I can expect in competition.”
The European Indoor Championships at Helsinki were, in Scott’s words, “Just a marker to see how I was going and I ran virtually my best times, indoors or out.”
All of these training sessions are minutely logged with charts showing not only what level a particular athlete is at any stage but also where he stands in relation to a specific targeted event, e.g. the World Masters Championships.
Such is Scott’s belief in his newly discovered training methods, he now uses them with the young athletes he coaches at Stretford and one of his charges, U15-girl Emma Cullen came away with a winning 100m/200m double at the recent Greater Manchester Championships.
Yes this is the interview I used as a summary in my earlier post.
I always remind myself of Michael Johnsons quote - I never cared if people new how I trained, because what worked for me may not work for them.`
There are many athletes that run fast with 2-3 sessions per week of race pace work. And nothing else. And not just at sprints but longer distances as well.
I think the question is do they just represent a higher proportion of highly gifted athletes who are able to thrive on doing just the components that are of most specific in nature. Probably are.
How much benefit do any masters athletes get from non specific work - tempo/endurance, weights, plyos in addition to the specific stuff. Is your speed work giving you 90% of your genetic potential, 80% … ?
its hard to see how you would ever get a decent study of this since you would need to get a runner to do 3xspeed per week for say 1 year. Then say 3xspeed per week + 1xtempo and 1xwts (or whatever).
Its is a particularly pertinant question for masters since their tendancy towards injury makes high volume of anything more risky.
Also, masters have high demands on their personal time limiting training sessions. Steve Peters is an extreme example - maths degree > maths teacher > medicine degree > doctor > phychiatric speciality as consultant > world renowned sports performance mental coach > author.
At what point in the yearly plan of Bill Collins does he schedule the first competitions? The program looks odd to me, as you would peak at week 52 when the season is over.
As for Peter’s approach, I would consider 500-600m of speed work 3x per week (not counting the first two 100m runs of each session, as they are below 90%) as fairly high volume. Certainly a lot more than I do.
What makes you so certain you would get faster on this program when there is so little speed work at 95-100% intensity, and such high volumes of mid to low intensity running, even right up to 4 days befor peaking.
I feel most masters athletes would not be able to take the large volume of running as wear and tear on muscles, ligaments and joints would be so great.
The is also an example of a 70 yo 800m runner( Gary Patton) world record holder, who only runs 2 x week. He says as soon a she cut out the garbage miles he stopped getting injured. He does a lot of weights and cross training in between his running day. Google his training if interested. This sort of confirms my belief that as we age we need less of the ancillary work and just the meat and potatoes.
I agree, Since going to 2 hi 3-4 lo my body feels fantastic. I actually feel good every speed session. Last few years when I did 3 speed days with speed volumes up to 500-600meters worth of work…I tore a calf muscle 2 of the years and the other I got plantar F. I was also skipping rope 3-4 times a week. Dropped all that extra stuff and I feel better.
surely this is not 100/200 runners ?
That shouldn’t matter much. Most sprinters won’t reach their peaks until they can run a good 200. I ran my best 100 in the summer that I ran my best 200 - Roman and starr use to push me to run the 200 every single week.
Yeah , this is the training for a 100m-200m runner. Bill Collins holdS numerous age group world records for the 100-200m. He doesn’t run the 400m. It’s hard to believe one could run so fast off such a program.
You should be more open minded. I’ll say it again I’m not surprise with the results at all. Only one way to make yourself a believer - is to try the program for yourself. Let’s not forget the big “G” word - Genetics!!!
Yes I agree …genetics plays a massive part, however, after reading many of Charlies manuals, Collins style of training is the exact opposite with nearly all the work in the mid range of 75%-90%.
Collins has had success with many runners not just himself, so this style of program obviously works. i just struggle to see how???
As I asked before, what makes you so certain you would succeed on such a program. I could only see injury for myself.
I would get faster for several reasons:
1: Not great but decent genetics.
2: Once I decide to do a certain program - I’m all in and believe its going to work. You gotta believe you are doing the best training program.
3: Consistency with my training.
If you have Belief and Consistency almost any training program will work!!!
Not to discredit any of Charlie work because I totally agree with everything Charlie has taught us about training. I’m sure Jesse Owens and Bob Hayes did their fair share of 75-90% work. More then one way to skin a cat.
90% work is great because it allows you to do more reps + higher frequency of work + more opportunities to practice your skill = faster results!!
I truly believe - once you begin to start training like a 50yr old athlete will be the day you start looking/performing like a 50yr old athlete. If you are 30-35 even 40 their shouldn’t be major changes to your program esp if you been training non stop since your 20’s.
I wonder if a program like Collins wouldn’t be best for the lower talented people. Many say the reason Collins and others excel on these programs is because they have lots of natural speed.
I understand that you supposedly aren’t really hitting speed and power as much on these type programs but for those with poor genetics, speed is the limiting factor and it’s marginally improvable. The Collins programs hit the fitness and endurance side harder. I could see throwing in more starts earlier to work the power end. And with the 50’s, 80’s, 100’s, 150’s you are training MaxV as well. So you still hit all of the key aspects for a fast 100 at your own potential.