"Starting Strength"(Book)

To the nipples is fine IMO.

Just a few comments for debate …

Power Clean
Pretty Good - feet in frame 8 - Should they be that flat at that stage? Frame 9 - Elbows slightly higher?

Squat -
The only observation I would make is in reference to the elbow angles.
In the Back Squat they seem to be pointed very far back, rather than straight down?
I was always taught to keep the elbows forward and down to lock in the bar and prevent kyphotic curve.
And in Front Squat up and forward - but seem pretty fine there.


Oh yeh … John - you always squat with the wedding ring on?

Did she weld it on you?

No I don’t I took that yesterday at around 6am :stuck_out_tongue:

Truth be told I wear mine more often than she wears hers. :stuck_out_tongue:

Rather than get sidetracked here I’ll post about it in my log.

Duxx, looks pretty good. Is that a snake tatoo on your leg?

I don’t understand you here Fergus… there are only 6 frames on clean… :confused:

Pointing elbows straight down is limited by external rotation…
Kiphotic curve is also a function of scapulae adduction too… this position allows you to adduct scapulae and make a muscle bulk for the bar… I heard simmilar story about elbow position as you stated… but Kilgore and Rip do this position… (see the clip from the book, at preceding page)

No… it is tribal… it is very simple, yet complex, and have no meaning too :smiley:
I will take a shot and post it :slight_smile:

What about the depth of the squats? I can go deeper, but I slighty loose lumbar lordosis — still far away from flexion, but I loose it. I also need wider opening of the hips to “clean” the torso with the legs…
I will try to post overhead version, and butt-to-the ground front and back squat, just to check my lumbar spine position…

The .mov version of the clean can be downloaded here. I would suggest opening it in ACDSee and rotating the image…

My “no-meaning” tribal… 2.5 years old! Plan to do another on my right arm… I really love the tattoos from Mauri (If this is how it is written John)

Sorry I meant frame 5.
(Stooopid me!)

Yeh - the elbow position/driection was just the way I was thought, I saw the book though reccomends different - I was just raising it more as a point of disucssion.
Though I’m not sure the muscle bulking is a sufficient reason for me personally.

Is the tat Serbian tribal or anything?

Hell, pulling to the bellybutton is fine IMO for a clean. What does our old buddy Gayle Hatch say … when the arms bend, power ends.

Yeh the Mauri ones are pretty cool.
Mike Mullins who used play with Munster over here, has one across/around his upper thigh and it looks real cool.

I am no expert, but I think that they should be on the floor during “drop under the bar” movement… some lifters utilize a more “jump to squat” under the bar (they lift their legs while dropping under – thus their feets are above the floor during this phase) and they push legs again hard to the ground when they catch it, the “pop” is heared when they catch it—Scott Vass in GPP DVD is a fine example of this style… I utilize more “smooth variation”, so the cathc it more “gentle”… I hope I managed to explain the difference… :wink:

The elbow back and up, thend to force you to lift your chest up which is good and facilitates good position of the spine (both thoracic and lumbar). In the same time it provides great muscle bulk from scap adduction and the bar can rest more easily — altought I fount that position (low bar) little paintfull at first… I also use (I saw this the first time on this pics of me – i didn’t know I use it!!) the elbows back and up in high bar position which can be seen too…
Will anyone else post his squat pics for analysis?

I would work on your hamstring flexibility (strength). Include some romanian and good mornings pushing the butt back.

Nah… it is just simple tribal without any secret meaning :slight_smile:

I do RDLs a LOT!!! a LOT!
Based on what “sign” did you made the suggestion? Is there any tip you can share? Thanks

The DKB doesn’t appear to come through as good as it could. When lifting the bar from the ground to the knees the position of the torso should remain relatively the same, but the knee joint angle should be the major contributor - pushing the hips back. The trajectory of the bar path seems to drift forward slightly as well - should be straight or going back. What do you think?

I think you mean he has to sit his ass back further before he lifts?

The actual explosive part of the Power Clean ‘pull’ doesn’t start at the ground level rather until the bar is just below knee level.

Aha… Yes, I know what do you mean!
Yes, the first pull should come only from knees, so does torso angle DO NOT change till bar reaches knee level… Torso angle (btw torso and floor) should be the same. I noticed that I very slighty eleveted my torso during the first pull, but I don’t think it is due short hams — rather because I still do not know to do first pull perfectly — maybe it is a hurry to jump…
It is better seen on the mov clip rather than on the pics…

The bar trajectory should be toward the shins as you xtend your knees… I tryed to look at this but it is hard from this angle… Thanks for the tips!

Mladen - PLEASE do not use my form in the GPP video as an example to model . . . EVER! :slight_smile:

Number 2 was still trying to clean up a lot of form issues when the video was shot. I too have transitioned to more of the ‘smooth’ variation that you mention.

Your (and Derek’s) effort in the gym to show as much of quality execution of movement is very appreciated… You should see how the hell people are doing power cleans (if they ever do it )… so your form is pretty good :smiley: :slight_smile:
Since I have first time watched GPP DVD I noticed that you hit the ground with the legs HARD right before you catch it… you pull your legs to a 1/4 squat position while still being in air, and before catching it you accelerate your legs to the ground… Derek uses simmilar technique in Fundamentals video… I think it is the result of “leg shuffle” he explains: so the athlete, after the jump, keep elevating legs while decending under the bar, and then hard split the legs (to allow squat – cathc) and hit the to the ground and stop pretty “suddenly”. I don’t believe this is an error, but I am more for soomth verson of the catch when there is not “pop” of the legs to the ground… What do you think?

To ‘stomp’ or not to ‘stomp,’ . . .

This is something that I have heard debated time and time again. You’ll find that this is emphasized by many strength and conditioning coaches for any number of reasons. However, it seems to drive many of the OL coaches insane - it’s not the stomp in particular - but more the fact that the feet are not in contact with the ground (the lifting of the legs you mention). One coach I know in particular looks like he’s going to have a heart attack every time he sees it . . “How can you apply force to the bar if you’re feet aren’t touching the ground ?!?!” he states, and then usually walks off muttering to himself.

Personally, I have transitioned more towards what I would term a small ‘slide’ with much less of an audible stomp heard - sort of a compromise between the two.

I haven’t watched the video in a while, but from what I recall, I had a lot of other form issues at the time - poor low back postition at the start, a contact point that was far too low (another coaching point that is taught incorrectly over here), not getting my hips through and up enough (more because I was being lazy with the light weight). Although it was not necessarily meant to be a form teaching video - more of exercise examples - it is definitely stuff I would like to go back and change.

The reason some coaches encourage the ‘stomp’ at the beginning of tecahing is that it encourages a snap in the catch and encourages the athlete away from this idea of a slow pull, no explosion and reverse curling the bar instead of catching it.

However it should move more then more to a ‘catch’, where the body dips under the bar to catch.