what about this brand: http://www.anyvitamins.com/vitalyze.htm
Is this a good one to buy?
Should such supplementation be kept strictly pre-race to boost response or can it be used regularly (i.e. 3 times per week) and still give an optimal ‘boost’ on race day?
i will throw my 2 cents in, i love power drive! its one of those supplements, and a rare one at that, where twice the dose does at least twice the results. i didnt get much from 1 dose pre workout, but i read chris Ts review on it and he doubles up and uses more than one dose a day. i tried this and it really kicks in at the higher doses. also, taking it on an empty stomach helps it work better.
i know this is easy advice to give because of my ability to source products at wholesale or below, but its something worth a run.
has anyone tried the twinlab version of the DL-Phenylalaine?
this quote is pulled from a amino acid page, i thought it was interesting:
Ketogenic. It forms acetoacetic acid and fumaric acid via L-Tyrosine. If L-Tyrosine is abundantly available in foods, the requirement level of L-Phenylalanine is reduced by half, but L-Phenylalanine is not formed from L-Tyrosine, so a certain amount must be ingested as L-Phenylalanine
L-Phenylalanine ¶ is an essential amino acid discussed in Dr. Slagle’s book “The Way Up From Down”. Used to help depression, low energy, low drive & motivation, aid dieting, & to recover from speed & cocaine addiction.
Fifty to seventy-five percent of L-Phenylalanine is converted to L-Tyrosine in your liver so all that applies to tyrosine applies to L-Phenylalanine.
The rest of L-Phenylalanine is converted to other products which account for it having some additional effects beyond those of tyrosine. One other product is the neurotransmitter phenylethylamine (PEA) which has Ritalin, amphetamine-like effects, which means it is mentally & physically stimulating. Studies have shown some depressed people have lower levels of PEA. These people will need phenylalanine to help with their depression.
Besides producing norepinephrine, dopamine, epinephrine, adrenaline & thyroid, phenylalanine is also a constituent of important brain neuropeptides, somatostatin, vasopressin, melanotropin, ACTH, substance P, encephalin, vasoactive intestinal peptide, angiotensin II, & cholecystokinins.
Because of its cholecystokinin effect, PA can have appetite suppressing benefits.
After numerous years of prescribing amino acids, Dr. Slagle has come to first prefer the use of tyrosine over PA for treating depression, low thyroid & stress. She has found tyrosine to virtually be without side effects, while PA can produce some agitation or irritability, headache, & can increase blood pressure in those already prone to blood pressure problems.
It is also possible some people don’t adequately convert PA to tyrosine because she has found more depression in those with a high PA to tyrosine ratio & less depression in those with a 2:1 tyrosine to PA ratio. Tyrosine is one step closer to most desired end products.
Dr. Slagle recommends PA be added for those needing extra stimulation, or appetite control. If she prescribes PA, she also gives tyrosine but at a different time of day.
Dear Muscleman:
If your athletes are getting an upset stomach
after competition from Vitalyze, it may be
from the copper contained in the Vitalyze.
Up to 4 capsules should not cause this effect,
because 4 capsules only contain the RDA
for copper of 2 mg. Each capsule contains
1/2 mg (500mcg). Some people get nauseous
when they take an excessive amount of
copper. If your athletes are taking more
than 4 capsules of Vitalyze before the
race, then this may be the problem. You
may want to try and just give them
phenylalanine and tyrosine 90 minutes
before the race as suggested in the post
above.
I see quite a bit of Red Bull use pre-race at meets.
For those not familair with Red Bull:
http://www.redbull.com/product/history/index.html
In 1982, Dietrich Mateschitz became aware of products called “tonic drinks”, which enjoyed wide popularity in Asia, and got - while sitting in the bar at the Mandarin Hotel in Hong Kong - the idea of marketing those functional drinks outside Asia.
In 1984, Mateschitz founded the company Red Bull GmbH. He fine-tuned the product, developed a unique marketing concept and started selling Red Bull Energy Drink on the Austrian market in 1987. Red Bull got off the ground in no time flat, giving people wings right from the start. In 1992, Red Bull touched down in its first foreign market, in Hungary. Today, Red Bull is energizing over 70 countries around the globe.
More than a billion cans of Red Bull are consumed each year. Responsibility for the unparalleled success of the world’s No. 1 energy drink is shared by the company’s 1,500 employees, of whom around 200 work at Red Bull Headquarters in Fuschl am See (pop. 1,344), not far from Salzburg/Austria.
Red Bull is much more than a soft drink - it is an energy drink. It was made for moments of increased physical and mental stress and improves endurance, alertness, concentration and reaction speed. In short: it vitalizes body and mind. The effectiveness of Red Bull Energy Drink has been proven by a large number of scientific studies and is appreciated by many of the world’s top athletes and drivers, opinion-leaders and hard-working people with active lifestyles.
All ingredients of Red Bull® Energy Drink are listed on the can. One can of Red Bull® Energy Drink (250 ml) contains the following ingredients:
carbonated water
sugar (sucrose, glucose) 27 g
taurine 1000 mg
glucuronolactone 600 mg
caffeine 80 mg
vitamins
niacin 20 mg
vitamin B6 5 mg
pantothenic acid 5 mg
vitamin B12 0.005 mg
Further, it contains inositol, citric acid/sodium citrate as acidifier, colours (caramel, riboflavin) and flavours.
Originally posted by gf_200
Should such supplementation be kept strictly pre-race to boost response or can it be used regularly (i.e. 3 times per week) and still give an optimal ‘boost’ on race day?
Charlie said that with stuff like this his athletes always (besides one or two experiments I assume) used it only before meets hoping that they’d get a better response.
Here is an interesting link:
http://www.chem.ox.ac.uk/mom/taurine/taurine.html
Taurine - Gives you wings?
Andrew Beer and Ben Cockbain - Hertford College, Oxford
Taurine
Synonyms: Aminoethanesulphonic Acid, 2-Aminoethanesulphonic Acid, 2-Aminoethylsulphonic Acid
Molecular Formula: C2H7NO3S
Molecular Mass: 125.1422g
Melting Point: 300oC
Water Solubility: 5-10g/100ml at 23.5oC
Form: White crystaline solid
Uses: Biochemical research, pharmaceuticals, wetting agents and also as an active ingredient in energy drinks, such as “Red Bull”.
Structure: H2NCH2CH2S(OH)O2
All about taurine…
Taurine is a nonessential sulfur-containing amino acid that functions with glycine and gamma-aminobutyric acid as a neuroinhibitory transmitter. At times of extreme physical exertion, the body no longer produces the required amounts of taurine, and a relative deficiency results. Taurine acts as a metabolic transmitter and additionally has a detoxifying effect and strengthens cardiac contractility. While taurine does not have a genetic codon and is not incorporated into proteins and enzymes, it does play an important role in bile acid metabolism. Taurine is incorporated into one of the most abundant bile acids, chenodeoxychloic acid where it serves to emulsify dietary lipids in the intestine, promoting digestion.
Derivation and location of Taurine
Taurine is a derivative of L-Methionine >>>>> L-Cysteine >>> Taurine. Taurine synthesis occurs in the liver and the brain. Concentrates of Taurine have also been found in extremely high concentrates in the brain, intestines and skeletal muscles.
Most amino acids have a L- or D- configuration, which means the molecule when put into a solution will rotate light either to the left (Levo=L) or the right (Dextro = D). Taurine does not polarize light and consequently does not have an L- or D- configuration.
It has been established that taurine concentration is extraordinarily high in the developing brain, and falls of sharply thereafter. This occurs at a time when the presumed synthetic pathway, via cysteine sulfinate decarboxylase, has little measurable activity, suggesting that a dietary source of taurine is essential. Moreover, it has been found that high concentrations of taurine are present in breast milk, which reflects the important need for taurine by the growing animal.
http://www.kilosports.com/productdesc.cfm?ProductName=DL-PhenylAlanine
DL-PhenylAlanine
DL-PhenylAlanine
Type: Powder 1 Kilo $99.95
Product Summary
DL-Phenylalanine is a “racemic” mixture, i.e., it consists of both the D- and the L-isomer of the dietary essential amino acid phenylalanine. The L-isomer is the one found in dietary proteins and as a constitute of your own tissue proteins. L-Phe is also a precursor to the conditionally essential amino acid tyrosine, and thus dopamine, norepinephrine and epinephrine.
The less common D-isomer of Phe has been found to inhibit an enyzme involved in the breakdown of endogenous pain killers, so-called “enkephalins”.
Russell and McCarty hypothesize (2000): “In the author’s clinical experience, concurrent treatment with DL-phenylalanine (DLPA) often appears to potentiate pain relief and also ease depression in patients receiving opiates for chronic non-malignant pain. An analysis of this phenomenon suggests that it may be mediated, at least in part, by up-regulation of the ‘endogenous analgesia system’ (EAS), a neural pathway that projects caudally from medullary nuclei to the dorsal horn of the spinal column; when stimulated by chronic pain or therapeutic measures such as opiates or acupuncture, the EAS suppresses activation of second-order pain-receptive neurons in the dorsal horn, and thereby alleviates pain. Since serotonin and enkephalins are key neurotransmitters in the EAS, it is reasonable to predict that measures which promote serotonin activity (such as 5-hydroxytryptophan and serotonin-reuptake inhibitors) as well as enkephalin activity (such as D-phenylalanine, an enkephalinase inhibitor) should potentiate EAS-mediated analgesia - a view consistent with much previous medical research. Comprehensive support of the EAS with well-tolerated nutrients and pharmaceuticals may amplify the analgesic efficacy of chronic opiate therapy, while enabling dosage reductions that minimize opiate side-effects. Analogously, this approach may complement the efficacy of acupuncture and other analgesic measures that activate the EAS.”
L-Phenylalanine has been found to stimulate BH4 production in the liver (Milstien et al., 1996). BH4, derived from folic acid, is a co-factor involved in the synthesis of various neurotransmitters as well as nitric oxide (NO2).
REFERENCES
Milstien S, Jaffe H, Kowlessur D, Bonner TI (1996). Purification and cloning of the GTP cyclohydrolase I feedback regulatory protein, GFRP. J Biol Chem, 271: 19743.
Russell AL, McCarty MF (2000). DL-phenylalanine markedly potentiates opiate analgesia - an example of nutrient/pharmaceutical up-regulation of the endogenous analgesia system. Med Hypotheses, 55: 283.
Suggested Doses
Take 1 gram daily.
Safety Issues
These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.
http://www.kilosports.com/productdesc.cfm?ProductName=L-Tyrosine
L-Tyrosine
L-Tyrosine
Type: Powder 1 Kilo $69.95
Product Summary
“Tyrosine is a conditionally indispensable amino acid. Although it is indispensable in neonates (12), it is a dispensable amino acid in healthy adults because it can be synthesized through hepatic phenylalanine hydroxylation (13) when sufficient phenylalanine is provided in the diet. However, in conditions known to impair aromatic amino acid metabolism, such as hepatic and renal disease, a preformed balanced source of the amino acid may be required to minimize aromatic amino acid excess and catabolism.”
REFERENCES
Roberts SA, Thorpe JM, Ball RO et al. (2001). Tyrosine requirement of healthy men receiving a fixed phenylalanine intake determined by using indicator amino acid oxidation. Am J Clin Nutr, 73: 276.
Suggested Doses
Take 5- 20 grams per day.
Safety Issues
These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.
Here is the link to a discussion on the old forum:
http://www.charliefrancis.com/board/philboard_read.asp?id=649&recordnum=40
my 2 cents- red bull is better as a cocktail mixer than a pre-activity sup. for serious athletes. Its too high in refined sugar for me to consider a cutting edge beverage-imho.
ive recently been turned on to power drive from biotest by members of this forum- id consider investing in this product rather than running down to the local quickie mart and stocking up on red bull’s
…or considering 716’s pre-race supplement protocol from the first post on the thread!
Thanks 716
Has anyone else (n4D) used the T&P combo. I notice a big improvement in concentration and alertness after supp with the reccomended doses of Tyrosine and Pheny. -
I’d def. reccomend it for team games.
I have tried red bulls, and i have found that they give me a headache and make me jittery, do you think that is an effect of the caffiene in it?
dexslave,
yes, more than likely its the caffiene.
Red bull is controversial.
There has been bad publicity surrounding its use in sport and social circles - in particular the ingredients - caffeine and taurine. The use of caffiene is of concern because reports sited excessive use contirbuting to hardnening of arteries, and cafeine - well because it’s cafeine!!!
Personally - I am careful with it’s use because of the very high sugar content !!!
23,
do you know of any scientific studies? I only ‘reports’ I have heard are of kids downing a bottle of vodka with Red Bull - ending up in hospital. Of course the Red Bull is immediatly blamed for such incidents!!