i still say to this day…ben johnson with perfect day could have run 9.60… that woudl be 6.25 to the 60 metre…and run it through…
ciao
If you do drive phase–or likekly if you coach it–you understand that it’s not really sitting, but not coming completely up. You run the race by sprinting with your head down, leaning forward, progressively coming up for (if you’re strong enough) half the race. When you do come up, it’s important to not overcorrect and lose some of your power and momentum: There’s a point in one of the HSI videos that Ato actually talks about this. This is where not overcoaching comes into place.
Look at some of the slow motion videos (Asafa, Gatlin, Mo) and look at upper body position as well as leg angles and extension. You seem to run the last 30-40 faster by maintaining some forward lean, and your leg is not (quite) fully extended. Most everybody has some form of mental cue to emphasize this late in the race.
Some of the discussion here seems a little like the guy trying to claim that you don’t “have to” use a round wheel when it’s possible to roll one with squared-off corners. When Powell, Gay, Gatlin, and Greene all do similiar things in the second half of the race–and their coaches are all NOT trying to force them into a concept that would change their mechanics–it’s hard to argue with a straight face that they’re not on to something.
I think you are extending from Ato’s comment on that clip (very good and helpful comments BTW). Ato discussed a smooth transition from the start to the final position- whatever that is for the individual- usually very upright for him- a little less so for Mo. He did not attempt to copy what Mo or anyone else was doing as he is a different individual.
I don’t like the description of not coming completely up as this might imply to some that the athlete is keeping the hips down. I don’t think that’s what you meant but you can speak for yourself.
I’m not talking about consciously keeping hips down. But I’m also NOT talking about forcing triple extension. I’m talking about “If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.” Ato and Mo didn’t do things quite the same way (and John Smith didn’t force it) just like Asafa doesn’t quite fit into other peoples’ model and Steve Francis didn’t force it, just like Clyde Hart didn’t force MJ to change his “wrong” running style, and a certain other coach didn’t tell Ben that jumping out of the blocks was a “dumb” thing to do.
Obviously, Asafa, Gay, and Gatlin all have VERY high hip height. The question you might ask is whether this is despite knees slightly bent or because of it?
This is breaking away from the themem of the most recent threads in this post, but I was sure the fastest speed recorded was Donovan Bailey at 27.4 mph, what does this translate to in m/s so I can compare it to Powell, Gay and Lewis?
27.4 mph=12.25 m/s
I would argue that Mo saw quite a lot of extension from memory. I will check some video footage and get back to you, but that’s certainly how I remember it. The lack of extension is certainly nowhere near as noticeable as Asafa for example.
What has Lewis clocked in m/s and Johnson, as it says over 12 m/s, but doesn’t give a specific figure earlier in the thread? I think an interesting point that hasn’t really been highlughted on this thread is the fact that they are striking further in front of the centre of gravity than we have been led to be optimal. Is this linked with the flexed support knee at take off? What else can this tell us?
.83 segment = 12.1mps average over the segemnt. The oft quoted DB speed is instant only and he never had a segment as fast as .83 officially recorded.
are we ready for some more yet?
[b]
- Introduction[/b]
Tyson Gay (USA) won the 100-m world title for men in 9.85 s, followed by Derrick Atkins (BAH) who
won the second rank in 9.91s, with world record holder Asafa Powell (JAM) attaining the third position.
Powell led the run from the start to a distance of 60 m; however, after 60~70 m, his speed decreased
suddenly. Taking the same time of 11.01 s, Veronica Campbell (JAM) defeated the defending
champion Lauryn Williams (USA).
In 100-m races, the important factors comprise the acceleration from the start to the top speed, the top
speed, and the decrease in speed just before the goal. Analysing 100-m races of the world
championship will provide extremely important data for planning the training strategy in a sprint. The
speed analyses of 100-m races were conducted by using video cameras or measuring instruments with
the laser beam method. This method could measure the running speed from start to finish with a
sampling rate of 100 Hz, although we had employed this method for evaluating the speed of the
sprinters during 100-m races.
2. Method
In this study, the apparatus using the laser beam (LAVEG Sport, JENOPTIK, Germany) was employed
for measuring the running speed. The error of measurement of this device is 7 cm, and the safety of
the laser beam is categorised as class 1 by the safety standard. In this study, we positioned the five
apparatuses at 64~68 m before the start line and 22~24 m above ground level (Figure 1). We
measured the running speeds during sprinting for all races of men and women, from the first to the final
round. In each race, five sprinters were selected based on their best performance in the daily
programme.
The measurement tools were positioned at the top of the stand behind the 100-m lanes such that
different noises remained in the data, affected by the tilting movement of the device, particularly from
the start to a distance of 40 m. These noises were removed by the spine interpolation; other noises
were removed by the 1-Hz low pass Butterworth digital filter. Using filtered data, the elapsed time of
10 m from the start to the goal was calculated using the distances-time curves data. From the
elapsed time, we calculated the running speed at each interval, the top speed and the rate of the
decrease in speed from the top to the last speed, i.e. from 90 m to 100 m. The official results were
used in the goal and reaction times.
3. Results
The measuring objects included 75 examples from the first to the final round; we obtained the data of
63 samples for men, with the goal time ranging from 9.85 s to 10.46 s, and the data of 71 samples for
women, with the goal time ranging from 10.99 s to 11.98 s. In our opinion, the data loss occurred
when the runner did not begin and qualify and when the laser light beam was unable to follow the
runners because the device was positioned high on the stand.
Goal time, top speed, the appeared distance of the top speed, the reaction time at the start, the
elapsed time of 10 m, the speed of a 10-m interval, the rate of decrease in speed from the top to the
speed of the last interval of every man and woman were recorded in table 1. These data represented
the data of the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 5th, and 6th ranked male runners and the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 6th
ranked female runners and the time of 10.99 s at their semi-final.
The maximum top speed attained by Gay (USA) over a distance of 60–70 m is 11.83 m/s; he was
followed by Powell who ranked 3rd with a speed of 11.79 m/s. Lewis (USA) whose goal time was 9.86
s recorded a top speed of 12.05 m/s in the men’s 100-m final at the third IAAF World Championships in
Tokyo in 1991. Thus, Gay’s top speed was 0.22 m/s slower than that of Lewis. With regard to the
women’s championship, Campbell (JAM) who attained the 1st position in the final was the fastest with a
speed of 10.56 m/s, followed by Williams (US) who ranked 2nd with a speed of 10.45 m/s.
The changes in the speed of the top three male sprinters have been recorded in figure 2. From the
start to a distance of 60 m, the tendency of changes in speed in Gay and Powell almost exhibited an
identical pattern; however, after covering a distance of 60 m, the speed of Powell decreased suddenly.
On the other hand, after this point, Gay maintained his speed at the same level, and decreased it
slightly just before the goal. The percentage of the decrease in speed was 2.2% in Gay and 8.1% in
Powell.
Figure 3 (below) presents the changes in the speed of the top two female sprinters. Taking the same time,
Campbell defeated the defending champion Williams and attained a top speed of 10.56 m/s in the
distance from 50 m to 60 m; however, after this point, her speed decreased. The top speed of
Williams who ranked second was lower than that of Campbell by 10.40 m/s. However, William’s
acceleration at the start and the ability of maintaining her speed was higher than that of Campbell.
Thus, during the distance from 70 m to the goal, the speed of Williams was higher than that of
Campbell.
Nanny:
Thanks for this info - its great
And the graphs are fantastic, you can almost pin point the place in which Gay came up on Asafa…!
There was a long thread on here just after the World Championships suggesting that Powell’s losing that race was not psychological but due to his training programme in the year leading up to that point. However, from this information, I would argue that something rather accute happened in order for him to decelerate that drastically in relation to Gay. 8.1% compared to2.2% seems quite drastic in my opinion. Thoughts??
If you watch the Japanese video analysis (multi part video) linked here a couple of weeks ago Asafa admits that it was psychological. I don’t know how you can argue that.
Reasons for performance:
1: Preparations
2: Preparation
3: Preparation
4: Preparation
etc
99: Psychology
Something that causes him… or anyone to decelerate drastically? Lack of prep time at the exact race pace required. When you actually hit it and repeat it for the first time in the season, it kicks your ass.
Look at his leanness on the vid of Osaka and then at his leanness in Rieti, after all the races of Osaka… and an appropriate recovery (What I like to call a ‘TAPER’ … oh, I know, I know… he doesn’t need to taper…)
If you can’t learn from history, you’re doomed to repeat it.
For those of you with I.A.D.D. (Information Absorption Deficit Disorder)
If you can’t learn from this forum, you’re doomed to be hit over the head with it by me till you do!!
Charlie, do you think other elements of the program may have been mistimed, besides the training?
Perhaps not getting enough therapy leading into Osaka, but getting it at Osaka?
Or even possible nutritional/supplemental protocols?
I thought that was clear from those pre-Osaka race records / tables posted on this site…
So, we can’t check on Olu? Damn! 
We can guess about some things but we can KNOW about how many races were run and when.