my theory

Charlie is clearly not a guru, if he was that sentence would be in a 4 part book costinf $59.95 per book. :smiley:

I have to agree with Charlie though. I look the 3 biomotor abilities - speed, strength and endurance. So speed is the main element in sprinting.

Also I look at the main movement in sprinting and I have been taught it is hip extension which is glute dominant with hamstrings playing a supporting role so I donā€™t understand how calves can be the main muscle

If an extremely long achilles tendon was the most important factor then surely almost ALL of the greats must possess this attribute??? go look at some photoā€™sā€¦ Lewis, Greene, Powell, Bullet Bob, Jesse Owensā€¦ none have particularly high calfs, in fact quite average or even lower than many African Americans/Caribbeansā€¦ Walter Dix.

So many different body shapes run fast which tells me itā€™s more important whats inside - CNS!!

I have noticed this as well. Some have long achilles, not all do I noticed the same thing as you on Powell, Greene, and Dix.

show me a picture of these these men showing them to NOT have a long achillesā€¦

and, a very development soleus doesnt mean the achilles isnt long eitherā€¦

p.s.

i have just look at pics of Dix and Powel and greene, and yes they have very long achilles tendonsā€¦

excuse my ignorance but where does the achilles end (the upper attachment)?

if high calves were THE factor, then lagat would be wr holder: :stuck_out_tongue:


Cant these guys run like 12.0 range and their speed work is like 600s.

I believe that they are faster than that though.

Arround 11.0, some of them (specially the 800/1500 guys) have really good speed.
Lagat has 1:46 for the half mile, so he needs that speed or at least arround 23 for the 200. Another example is webb with 1:43.xx, that requires a decent amount of base speed.

O but im talking the 5/10k guys :smiley:
How much speed those guys got?

I believe they never ever run anything below 400m in competition. Galen Rupp recently ran arround 50s (indoors), but they run from strength and not from speed (very poor speed reserve).
If you are running 50 for the 400 / under 3:40 for the 1500 then you have to be able to break 12 or run very close to 12.

im kinda suprised this is even being talked aboutā€¦

as far as i knew, it was known and much research has been done on itā€¦

long achilles tendons are important factors in sprinting and jumpingā€¦

i dont think there is much to argue aboutā€¦

fibre types, practice, etc etc all play a role in wheather you can sprint or run distanceā€¦

Who are you comparing tendon length to?? Yourself?? Remember this is in comparison to the Black population and Dix, Powell and Greene have (IMO) very average if not shorter achilles than the average black male achilles length.

Iā€™ve never seen any research into achilles length and performance. As far as I knew it was a sound theoryā€¦ however if it was so important then the top sprinters and jumpers would ALL have VERY long achilles, but many donā€™t! Lewis, Powell, Johnson, Dix, JESSE OWENSā€¦ If extra long achilles were so important then how the heck did Robert Emmiyan jump 8.86 :eek:

What you donā€™t see is very SHORT achilles at the world stageā€¦

You can have all the type IIb you want and achilles up to your ears but if it ainā€™t all wired right then it ainā€™t workin!!!

Jonathan Edwards and Stefan Holm have very low calves. There are plenty of sprinters with (relatively) low calves, but almost none with wide hips.

The physical (observable) characteristics that top sprinters seem to have are: Broad shoulders, narrow hips, relatively long legs, long achilles (double whammy of extra tendon and less weight at the end of the lever), small feet and possibly lark heel, although this is harder to see. Top sprinters also tend to be tall.

I read somewhere recently that Asafaā€™s foot is 289mm, which seems quite big. Tyson Gay seems to have fairly wide hips for a sprinter.

well, ok but i disagreeā€¦many of these jumpers have very developed soleusā€™s which does make their calf (gastoc) look lower when in fact they arentā€¦

also, you can NEVER say, that ALL or EVERYONE should do or be like any one particular thingā€¦

There are many examples of extremley fundermental and accepted technical models throughout sports which some of the VERY BEST seem to totally ignoreā€¦thats just sports and performance for youā€¦(and please, iā€™m sure your aware that the Emmyenn guy should not be placed in any catagory with other athletesā€¦

However, i am positive that if you look at every guy under 10.20, under 20.50, over 8.30m, 17.20m etc etc and a very high percentage of them have long achilles tendonsā€¦

1 or 2 or 50 pictures will not disprove thisā€¦

Actually, I thought that I read a study where they re-wired muscle fibers to faster neurons and the fibers changed type. That is, you donā€™t have type IIb unless you are wired right!

Really? That is fascinating.

Tyson Gay most likely doesnā€™t have fairly wide hips. Itā€™s more likely that his gluteus medius is so developed that it gives off the illusion of him having larger hips than he really has.

if it isnt wired right?

what does this meanā€¦

Donovan Bailey had wide hips from what I remember as well as Walter Dix and Patrick Johnson.

Iā€™m referring to the CNS.

yes cns is really imporatant, but the fact is that we can not control right, it is nature process,
ps. i think most important for sprinters are back, behind, quads, and strong foot fingers,
but some people have NO 1 AND NO 2 fingers the same lenght, mabey this would help them to run faster ???

Good thread.

My 2 cents.

All movement starts from the centre. :wink: