bumping it up.
All I’m going to say is that I don’t see any Alumni donations to the U of M track program coming any time soon from said athlete.
Although, I must say that even I am embarrassed for that particular Track program. I cannot see how they could mess someone up that badly. It’s almost as though it was a pre-meditated crappy training program. It is the George Costanza training program - “Think of the proper training, then do exactly the opposite!”
It’s brilliant! A program about nothing! The assistance coach can be Kraemer.
William or Cosmo?
Can anybody give the name of this guy? I’m just curious. Also, can anybody here give me some details as to just what in the hell we’re doing so wrong in Ann Arbor?
Go back to the beginning of this thread and read the post-that’ll give you a better idea of all that is wrong.
Go back to the beginning of this thread and read the posts-that’ll give you a better idea of all that is wrong. I had, still do, a good idea of what was wrong with football but prior to the posts by No.2, did not realize that sports other than football and basketball were training in such a way. Still, Go Blue!
Another thing people should remember is that Braylon Edwards did his speed development work with his father, who just so happens to be a specialist in this aspect of S&C. And another thing, Larry Foote had to go outside the program to get faster. In fact, he went to our womens track coach (James Henry). It just really pisses me off to know that our guys have to elsewhere to get quality advice on training. :mad:
Another thing people should remember is that Braylon Edwards did his speed development work with his father, who just so happens to be a specialist in this aspect of S&C. And another thing, Larry Foote had to go outside the program to get faster. In fact, he went to our womens track coach (James Henry). It just really pisses me off to know that our guys have to elsewhere to get quality advice on training.
You are exactly right. When your name is Mike Gittleson, and you are a hire of Bo Schembechler, you are a sacred cow. Though it appears things have improved somewhat, they have a long way to go before it can be said that they are optimally developing athletes. Many of MG’s supporters use Braylon’s development as an example of MG’s great skill. Of course, as you mention, they fail to realize how much work he did with his Dad throughout his stay at UM to at least offset the negative work of being in a HIT program.(Next Level? track club).
This is the sort of thing that prevents our program from moving forward. There is just too much inbreeding at U-M. I love our new and aggressive defense under Ron English, however, I still believe when Lloyd retires that we need to go outside the program for his replacement. We simply need a clean break from the Schembechler regime. Also, I said in April of 2003 when we hired English that he was my favorite coach on the staff. The sick thing is he hadn’t yet coached a game for Michigan yet. That should tell you what I thought of our putrid staff at the time.
By the way, Pioneer, I just recently watched our 2003 game with Minnesota on ESPN Classic. Ditto for Purdue 2004. After only four games with English, it’s just sickening to watch how we played defense under Jim Herrmann. I already feel spoiled after only four games with English. 
At UM, very few people could possibly have any idea what proper s and c looks like since MG has been there since 1978-most there don’t know any different, any better-tha’t a long time to be training people improperly though UM certainly has had a lot of success over the years, despite MG, because of the pure talent they are able to recruit. That is no longer good enough to win and more importantly, to win big. They have been “getting by” for many years but no longer, so LC himself finally had to say the players needed to lose weight and finally good nutritional advice is being given though using distance runs on the golf course is hardly a good thing to develop speed, let alone keep from losing it.
My two takes on Lloyd hiring English and finally getting JH out of there is great he made the move but the other part of that equation is why did it not happen a lot sooner? I like much about Lloyd but he sure seems slow to change, though to his credit he made a number of significant changes this past off season-7 and 5 sure does change your focus, resolve. It’s not as though Herrmann was only bad last year, the d had been poor, underachieving for some time. Did we really need to suffer through that many bad years of d before a change was deemed necessary.
Now, what of DeBord? What about Gittleson-he’s safe, I feel, as long as Lloyd remains as H.C. I have heard that English was critical of our team’s poor physical condition-wonder who’s fault that could possibly be?
I don’t think it’s important to name names of athletes who were trashed by the U of M coaches. I wouldn’t want there to be any bad feelings or repercussions, as I’m sure that many people who attended U of M still had a good college experience (aside from the training).
I think all that needs to be done is to look at the results of sprinters (and other speed/power athletes) going into their first year, and finding out how much they improved over their four years there. Anecdotal information tells me that the majority of athletes didn’t improve or only improved marginally. Many were injured constantly.
It consistently amazes me that people will willfully avoid the truth and superior methods of training for reasons of ego (more so than ignorance - but it still plays a part) to the detriment of those they are paid to help (the athletes). In fact, it sickens me. I see it even at my current place of employment. But - what can you do? I just know that their lack of results make my results look that much more impressive. If everyone trained properly, it would be tough to stand out in the crowd.
I understand. Thanks anyway. 
Anyway, Pioneer is right. It took way too long for changes to be made. Cronyism is the reason why those changes weren’t made a long time ago.
There have been documented changes made and then there are changes that have been rumored to have taken place. Only time(and some inside scoops) and the continued on the field performance will confirm much. I’m interested to see if the current program can continue to maintain the (at least seemingly improved) condition that we have gotten out a 4-0 start with.
I wonder, for example, if there is a continued, in-season, emphasis on maintaining sound nutritional practices and keeping the bodyweights at the current levels or will they get let everything go to hell. (Hopefullly they have scrapped the stupid 3.5 mile golf course distance runs-this is moronic!) This has has been the case in the past. Fix the problem, at least temporarily, and then forget about it only to have the issue rear it’s ugly head again somewhere down the road to the complete surprise of the coaching staff! We shall see but for now-Go Blue!
Some of that ego leads to the ignorance. There has long been this belief that I can’t be wrong so why look at other methods. Their refusal to carry out tests that would go a long way to disproving their outdated methods of conditioning are simply never done. The only evidence appears when the UM guys that came in as very highly rated players( and are often shown to test very well in standarized high school combines) 4-5 years later put up awful 40 times and verticals.
Then the fans claim that all the recruiting services must have overrated all or most of their players-sure they picked on the UM recruits to overrate the most.
Just as you say, the guys who come in as freshmen with very good, documented numbers, often look good as freshmen and sophs. but appear to look worse physically each year. They appear to be a bit larger but always(for lack of a better term) sluggish in their movements.
I’m often amazed that the guy whose job it is to condition the team takes no apparent heat for guys who never develop physically, level off after a year or two in the program. I’d like to see him try his great methods on kids who are not so physically gifted as the UM recruits and see how those guys fare.
The success the kids have had in the past were in spite of the incredibly lacking program. This year, some things appear to be better but the claim has always been “we do what is safe for the athletes, not dangerous lifts like cleans and squats”(paraphrasing) -sure, last year’s extremely high injury rate supports the notion that UM’s sHIT training is so safe and is great work to prevent injuries.
After reading all of the threads its obvious that we all agree on 1 thing. That is the program sucks and nobody seems to take the blame for all of the failures that they have had on all the athletes for using the program. But I must say that even though the program sucks I still learned alot from msu because of outsiders coming in from like usc, mississippi state univ, u of florida, florida state just to name a few. There also seems to be alot of michigan fans on this particular thread. I must admit I’m very loyal to michigan state so I gotta represent for the green and white. GO GREEN! GO WHITE!
Just for the record I dont like this arguement too many variables.
Over this supposed period of sHIT Michigan has put together the longest streaks of Bowl appearances and seasons at or above .500, 31 and 38.
I am definately not saying it is because of the strength program but its not just because of recruiting. No other team can boast either of these so they have to be doing something right. Is it good coaching, good recruiting, good supplements, good strength coaches they go to outside the program, smarter players, etc, but regardless they are doing something good and I think you need a lot more than just recruiting to put up those numbers.