Face pulls are a good exercise to assist in arm deceleration for the overhead thrower. Does anybody do anything different with fastpitch softball pitchers?
Chin-ups/pull-ups, every variation of row known to man (and some that are not),most standard rotator cuff exercises and probably the most important one of them all : LESS THROWING AND PITCHING!
It’s amazing some sports still believe that more is better. They don’t quite understand the difference between quality work and volume
work.
TNT
What kind of volume parameters do you consider optimum for children/adolescents?
Volume parameters are the same for children, adolescents and adults. At the very first sign of a drop in quality -STOP! Go to something else- like a coffee shop. Make them hungry to come back.
I’ve watched practices where the batter took 60+ swings against a pitching machine at the rate of about a pitch every 5 sec. You can imagine what the last 10 looked like. SHIT.
“Doing a little often is far better than doing a lot rarely.”
TNT
Coffee shop??? The only time I would give my kid caffeine or sugar would be if I knew she wasn’t going to be with me for the next few hours.
Seriously though, I was thinking along the lines of optimum volume so that quality doesn’t drop off but the maximum training effect is achieved. I believe that it’s always better to end on a high note.
My daughter needs about 30-40 throws before she’s warmed up properly. I don’t want to wear her out by having her throw each practice until she starts throwing poorly. Right now she has softball practice a couple of times per week so it’s not a huge issue, but that will change with the weather. She’s a catcher so over/under training is a particular concern.
Increasing a pitcher’s work capacity is also huge I feel. Long toss and extra throwing can be real detrimental if overtraining begins to set in, as stated above, but at the same time, long toss just adds so much velocity to your throw’s (both underhand and overhand). So increasing the athlete’s ability to handle long toss I think is the most important thing for ‘on the field training’. Learning to field a ground ball or catching a flyball can be taught whenever, but throwing really depends on recovery. Increase recovery ability, and it’ll show.
Why is she having “practices” during the off-season? How old is she?
TNT
She’s 11. We practice a couple of times per week. Tournaments start in March. Season ended in July and practice started up end of November beginning of December.
The most important thing to remember is contained in your first sentence. SHE’S 11.
I do S&C and speed with 5 different levels: U-14, U-16, U19,
Jr. and Sr. This past fall I “inherited” an entire U-16 team. Out of 11 girls, only 1 does not have shoulder problems. The coach can’t wait to go indoors in Jan. and start “thowing”. The throwing was the cause of the problem. Throwing more will not fix it. These 15 year old ballplayers, will have a season that is longer than professional ballplayers. Don’t get caught up in the philosophy that playing more ball will make her better.
TNT
I certainly wouldn’t advocate more throwing if she were having shoulder problems. Her upper body S&C is geared specifically to injury prevention. Practices are not straight throwing throughout. I also believe that many “overuse” injuries are more a function of structural imbalances than an inevitable consequence of repetitive movement.
And how are those “structural imbalances” arrived at? Poor posture, more sitting at a desk/keyboard than most office workers, knapsacks, TV, more sitting in an auto going to practice/game. The multi-sport ones seem to be the worst ones. SB, then VB (same overhand motion), BB and hockey. The multi-sport athlete gets a double and triple dose which then ends up in being a year-round shoulder destruction program.
Curious. How many chin-ups/pull-ups can she do?
TNT
She can do 4 pull ups. And you’re right about the backpacks but it seems to compromise the backs more than the shoulders. I can’t believe how much these little kids have to lug around - it’s like infantry on march with full packs - and worse footwear.
I agree that posture is a big issue and that’s why she’s in cotillion (kidding). She actually has fair posture for a kid but we have to bring her attention to it occasionally.
Throwing athletes need to throw all year long. As in any well designed program all the elements of training should be present at all times but to different degrees, especially throwing athletes. There is nothing that can prepare the shoulder for throwing like throwing. There is however, many different forms of throwing here are a few that we use:
1- Pull down throwing - focus is on pulling down through the ball for high velocity, all throws are of a flat trajectory (no hump)
2- long and loose - to lengthen throwing action, recovery after throwing (the throwing action intensity is altered - no pull down there is a hump in the throw throws will range from 100 to 400 ft depending on the ability and age of the athletes. If indoors just throw into a net. There are no changes of speed in the throwing action; we look for smoothness and length of arch. The ball is thrown from a higher release point (no casting or peeling off stay through the ball)
3- Tempo throwing - we use this variation to flush the arm and build some endurance similar to long and loose except the intensity is lower, but the duration is longer - purpose is to improve endurance of throwing muscles (focus on the use of legs and hole body throwing (learning to be efficient with little stress on the arm) The ball is thrown from a higher release point (no casting or peeling off stay through the ball). We usually use this method followed by a medi ball throwing medi ball complex.
4- Position specific throwing - as players get loose they will throw from designed distances and make position specific throws.
5- Light catch - just to get the arm loose at short distances with excellent mechanics
We alternate many different forms of throwing to promote different results, from recovery and regeneration to strengthening and mechanical efficiency.
Most injuries to throwers are a result of: inadequate throwing, poor mechanics, poor conditioning (weak cuff-scap-thorasic complex, core, legs and hips), and a predisposition to shoulder problems (previous injury, accumulation of micro trauma).
Progression is the key, with a well periodized throwing and healthy shoulder conditioning program.
We have a couple of girls on our team who are small but pound-for-pound probably throw harder than anyone on our team. Their mechanics seem good but the main difference that I’ve noticed is that their shoulders rotate back several degrees further than everyone else. Other coaches think that this is fine but to me it looks like their shoulders are too loose and they may be headed for shoulder problems down the line. Does this seem plausible? What would be considered optimum rotation in the the overhead throw?
Don’t trust the human eye. Get a camera. Throwing is more complex than sprinting.
When you get it figured out let me know the answer.
TNT
Throws will range up to 400 ft.? 
I can’t remember the last time I saw a MLB outfielder throw 400 ft! Come to think of it, I don’t think I’ve ever seen it. How many athletes you have known who could?
I was going to say something like Nap’s post, only he said it better. I was going to say that kids used to play and now they practice. They don’t do enough just throwing throwing, just tossing it around w/ your friends, or not throwing that day at all. Athletes who aren’t shoved through a prescribed w/o (including pushing themselves through what they think they “should” do) usually make adjustments without even realizing it. They don’t “feel like” throwing or running today, so they don’t. They do what their body “feels like” doing, and often that’s the best guide. Nap’s post, while good, is kind of just regimenting what we used to do as kids just playing. If I were to put it in a nutshell – throw more, pitch less. Of course, if there are already shoulder problems, that’s different, I’m talking preventive here.
While nap’s program sounds great for a college age ball player or above, the girl being discussed here is 11 years old. Thanks juggler.
TNT
Have their been any studies comparing the rate of shoulder injuries among Central American kids that play year round to North American kids who don’t play during the winter? I realize there could be other contributing factors but it would be interesting.
TNT, why were you curious about the number of pullups she could do?
TNT - why would you think that Nap’s program would be appropriate for college player or above? If you’re talking about emotional maturity that’s one thing but from a structural standpoint I would think that the younger kid would recover more quickly. This would also fall more closely in line with your earlier stated motto of “Doing a little often is far better than doing a lot rarely.”