I have a question about the bobsled push at the start. From my understanding, ground contact is needed to get the sled moving. There is a big difference in sprint starts and bob starts…
What is the significance of difference of the two? Would longer ground contact create a faster explosion at the start?
I dont know if there are any former experts on the bobsled sport, but any imput is welcomed…
thanks…
Yes, it would be very interesting to go in depth about bobsled start and the phsycal preparation of those amazing athletes…
I remember chris T. on the T.mag forum reporting some stats of former and current canadian pushers, and the coach of usa bobsled used to post here some times .
Bobsled start requires tremendous maximal leg strength to get the sled moving. GCT are longer at the push due to the obvious weight of the sled. Once the sled is moving it is essentially weightless due to low friction along the ice. Also, and this will change from run to run, the sled will ge greatly effected by gravity as the run begins to go downhill almost immediately from the start.
The physical preparation for these athletes is mostly centered around the squat, both front and back. Done explosively with a pause at the bottom as competition nears. Also cleans from blocks as there is little stretch shortening at the start. Well, depending on what kind of start you use. Upper body trainng centers around close-grip benches and rows of all types.
Releative strength is important due to weight restrictions of the sled and crew combined. So hypertrophy is not needed.
yes is true…although the ssc is important in the running phase…the pusher should have some of the qualities of the 60 m indoor specialist, acceleration from still, and some others of the 200m specialist, top speed and length of stride.
Generally speaking top running speed is not always achieved due to the weight of the sled. Elite bobsleigh athletes are unique in that they are not a “cookie cutter” type athlete. Meaning they come in all shapes and sizes and from various athletic backgrounds. Most from track and field. The one thing they have in common is that they are all very explosive.
Thomas…you seem very knowledgeable…are you involved in bobsledder’s training?
eroszag, I was, briefly, in the mid to late 90’s.
interesting enough…next year I think I’ll attend the driving course in saint moritz or in cortina to get the driving bobsled licence…I’ll ask you later on
my sentiments exactly. i am planning on going to bobsled pilot school this yr in lake placid. i would like to add enough weight to be super competitive…but another 20 or 30 lbs…is hard…
let me know how its going for ya eroszag…
well…I 'm training for my sports,I’ll be looking to increase my body weigth for next year, since I’m a bit thin 167 lbs right now
however…1st I hope to learn how to drive well enough not to risk my life every time!:))
then…who knows…keep in touch…ciao
The bobsleigh breakman is Pascal Caron you participated in two olympics for Team Canada.
His lifetime bests are:
Bench press: 425lbs (BWT 173lbs)
Full back squat 500lbs (BWT 173lbs)
Power snatch from hang 225lbs (BWT 173lbs)
Power clean from hang 275lbs x 3 (BWT 181lbs)
Bench press 225lbs for reps: 36 (BWT 187lbs)
Bench press 315lbs for reps: 15 (BWT 187lbs)
60m (FAT start, electronic): 6.41 (performed 3 weeks ago)
He has now started his indoor track season … he competed last weekend, it didn’t went very well, ran something like a 6.8 / 60. I don’t like to make excuses, but the week before the competition he wasn’t able to train on the track at all because our center wasn’t open. He drove 2 hours to go train in Montreal but when he got there the track was closed. So he competed on Saturday and his last intense track session was 12 days before. He came in very flat. No worries, the season is young!
Also, Giulio Zardo (Pierre Lueders’ partner) back squats over 600lbs, power snatch 275lbs and power clean 352lbs.
Bobsleigh is somewhat similar to football in that there is not only one type of athlete who perform well. This is especially true of the four-men bob. The no.2 and no.3 crewmen are generally big, strong and powerful with decent speed (think linebacker and big running back). The breakmen (no.4) is more of a speedster (as he is the one providing the last acceleration while the sled is virtually weightless, so pure speed is more important than power at this point) … think of a 600-100m sprinter-type.
The driver is a different animal, he is generally the bigger guy, he doesn’t need as much speed as the others (because he doesn’t push for very long) but he must be very strong.
CT, what’s going on with the new e-book for this site?
Christian, you’re right on about the brakeman on the 4-man bob. He or she needs to be the fastest because as the sled starts to pick up speed, the brakeman has to keep up with the sled.
In St. Moritz, I think it was in '95. A driver missed getting into the sled in the 4-man bob. The 2 push athletes, seeing the driver not get in and not to risk injury, let the sled go. The brakeman, who was the fastest, held on, jumped in and pulled up on the brakes. Needless to say there was a good deal of track to repair.
Having a strong driver is great if you can get it. I compare bobsleigh drivers with some Div. I or pro quarterback. Just as QB’s spend the majority of their time learning the offense, reading defenses, watching game tape, etc…and little time for training… bob drivers are consumed with every aspect of the sled. The steering, the runners, the D ring placement, etc… Some are so neurotic it seems like a OCD. The sled has to be tinkered with everyday. Many have little time for training and feel that sled performance and driving the sled takes priority over everything else.
Thats why on some teams, if you watch closely, the driver will have three horses behind him, push for 5-10 meters and jump in and let the team push him and the sled. Now this depends on the run, event or practice, and level of conditioning of the entire team.
Todd Hayes and Leuders may be the exception to the rule and perhaps the German drivers.
eroszag, learning how to drive is priority one! You can be the strongest, fastest athlete out there but if you can’t get the sled to the bottom of the run you’re not going to be successful.
Bobsleigh drivers for the most part are all willing to help each other out. Except maybe when there is money and medals to win.
Ask questions, ask questions, ask questions! Before and after your practice runs, walk the course. Stand in the run, and look at the turns. Look out for sleds. See how other sleds enter and exit the turns. Look where they set up their entrance into the turns from the straightaways. Ask, ask, ask questions. Once you’ve spent enough time in the sled, go to other tracks and practice there.
Eventially(sp) you can be a pilot bob for World Cup races or World Championships. Essentially, spend as much time as you can sliding someplace.
Thomas, I’ll sure do, but I think next season…Hey Chris T., and so Caron recovered…I remember he got injuried at the beginning of the january( or february?)hope he is going well…keep us posted on his achievements,and are you still planning to write an article on T-mag dealing with his training?(it will be the old ascending descending training o r smthing more?)thanks, and soon I think I’ll get your books, your alst articles are as good as ever…
Yes, Pascal got injured 6 weeks prior to the last games. He underwent over 4 hours of treatment per day for 3 weeks! His injury healed but he wasn’t in tip top shape.
He used the ascending-descending training program indeed. The article about it is already written, it should be published shortly.
Right now we are using an abridged version of this program to cope with the intense demands of an indoor track season (and the reduced need for upper body brute force).
We are now only using 2-3 exercises per session, performing two lower body sessions and one upper body session per week.
since we are talking about him…his speed training is Francisesque?(short to long?)other than the jumps in the program A_D, he perform multi jumpsduring the pre competitive and competitive block?( I mean multijumps, like 3-5-10 alternate,or 60-100m of jumps, like the italian sprinters.)
thanks Chris…
Chris T, what’s the status of the new e-book?
Yes, he first develops acceleration and top speed, then works on maintaining his top speed.
He doesn’t do jumps outside the gym, they are part of the strength training program.