yeah, i also noticed that after guys tapped he seemed to hold on a lot longer than he had to.
as for TUF, ed didnt impress me at all as i was really pumped to see how explosive he was and i was disappointed. he must be rusty or something, because even tito is impressed with him, so i am sure it wasnt his best to say the least-but he won and thats the point.
He would continue holding his techniques after the guys tapped because on one occasion a guy tapped and Royce let go, but the ref didn’t see anything, and then the guy kept on attacking Royce. Royce still won that fight, but he never let up on the technique from that point on until the ref pulled them apart.
I can see holding on, but there were guys who had their arms broken. That ain’t necessary.
And yeah, from watching their fight from UFC 1, it seemed Shamrock tapped but then said he hadn’t.
I don’t know. It’s hard to say unless you have really been in that situation. You have to hold on until the ref says stop. Royce never struck me as that kind of person. Plus, in those days, people were not used to those submission holds. Nowadays people know when a hold is sunk in and they tap. Look how fast Georges St. Pierre tapped out to Matt Hughes, he knew the type of hold he was in and he knew the only way out was a broken arm, so he tapped. The last broken arm I saw was when Frank Mir put a hold on Tim Sylvia. When they showed the replay in slow-motion you could actually see the break happen, Tim’s inner forearm bulged grotesquely. Talk about stubborn! Ken Shamrock on the other hand is famous for beating the shit out of guys who tried to train at his gym. This was after you did all the physical conditioning tests to even qualify to step on the mat: 500 hindu squats, 250 pushups etc. Even Frank Shamrock said Ken beat him down bad the first time he went to the gym and confirmed the physical tests. It will be interesting to see what happens in the Hughes/Gracie fight. If Royce breaks Matt’s arm then we will know for sure he is a thug. I can’t see Matt hanging on so long as to get his arm broken. He tapped out to B.J. Penn pretty quick (and nobody was more surprised than B.J.!), better to tap out with honour than to pass out. Royce might just be stubborn enough to get his arm broken though. The Gracie pride might not let him quit. Remember, he fought Sakuraba for 90 minutes, part of that with a broken leg!
Re Gracie pride: That’s kind of why I do see Royce breaking guys up semi-intentionally. Helio used to have fights that didn’t end until someone got hurt. Royce may be of this mindset, too. I certainly see him not submitting until he was totally screwed, and maybe not even then. The ultimate, as Matt said, would be to make Royce submit, but it would be very stupid to go for that. He should “just win, baby”.
On the Hughes/Gracie show, I liked the part about how Matt and Royce are training. I’d like to see/hear more from both of them about their training and fight philosophies.
[QUOTE=Juggler]Re Gracie pride: That’s kind of why I do see Royce breaking guys up semi-intentionally. Helio used to have fights that didn’t end until someone got hurt. Royce may be of this mindset, too. I certainly see him not submitting until he was totally screwed, and maybe not even then. The ultimate, as Matt said, would be to make Royce submit, but it would be very stupid to go for that. He should “just win, baby”.
Yeah, Matt should just take what Royce gives him. If a submission opportunity presents itself, take it but don’t bank on it. The more I think about it the more I think Matt has the right strategy, keep it standing. You could see in the countdown he has been working on his boxing. If he can stuff the takedown attemps a la Chuck Liddell, he could probably score points by picking Royce apart with strikes, maybe even a knockout.
In some of the fights his opponents would tap out on the mat and obviously if Royce doesn’t see it he’s not gonna let up. If they tap on Royce’s body then he’d probably let up alot quicker.
Just a friendly reminder the fight is PPV this saturday! I.E. tomorrow! Try going to a Boston Pizza and see if you can get in for free!
Too often we see guys try to prove some point by taking the guy on at his own game. This usually doesn’t work well. Matt would be foolish to voluntarily grapple with Royce, and probably won’t.
I believe the worst of Gracie holding on for too long would be when he faced Deluca or Delucia i think his name is. Gracie was on the ground and had an arm bar locked in. Deluca tapped his leg and Gracie proceeded to force Deluca to the ground. It must’ve been a broken arm from that.
I think Gracie is the thug and cocky MOFO in this match up. He’s been saying thing like: Hughes is jealous of him…i’d like to see the UFC guys of today fight four guys in one night and win them all…
It’s not that Hughes can’t fight four guys and win them all it’s that it’s not set up that way anymore.
Hughes is the favorite, Gracie not only needs to learn that fighters of today are of a breed that has evolved and actually well rounded as opposed to being one dimensional as well as learning to spell his damn name right if we wants it to sound like Hoyce. Am i to presume Hot sounds like Rot in Brazil?
That was about what I expected, a decisive beatdown by Matt Hughes. I was about to give a recap, but now realize I’m too tired. Was a decent night of fights though.
I missed the fight, I am pissed off to say the least. Anyway, I heard the news, apparently the big showdown wasn’t much of a contest after all, with Hughes getting the stoppage in the first round after pummeling Gracie on the ground. Impressive! What’s next for Hughes, a rematch with Georges St. Pierre or Karo Parysian?
Brandon Vera sure was making some noise after his victory, saying he will hold the heavyweight and lightheavyweight titles eventually. A bold claim, looks like the heavyweight division is finally heating up. Vera will have to get through Tim Sylvia or Andrei Arlovski first. Speaking of which, it’s time for the next round of predictions. Who takes the rematch, Sylvia or Arlovski? I’ll say Arlovski, he’s too fast for Sylvia and he has too many weapons. He got caught last time but I think he’ll finish Sylvia quick this time.
Arlovski…
Well, Matt (the deaf wrestler) and Mike (tatoo dude) fought last night on TUF. Matt hurt his arm in practice (an armbar courtesy of Mike Bipsing, he should have just tapped), so he decided to keep the fight standing (also to avoid Mike’s submission attempts). This was definately the worst fight so far, in my opinion. What a mess. After all his talk about knees etc., Mike’s standup game was horrible! Matt’s wasn’t much better but at least he was landing some good shots, he wasn’t even that fast but Mike kept walking into punches. Finally Mike tagged Matt a few times but it was too late. Matt wins by unanimous decision, easy one for the judges.
So now onto the semi-finals. Ken’s team has two good middleweights in Kalib and Ed but Ed looked rusty last week. If he is matched up against Kendall, my money is on Kendall in that fight. Kalib is the unknown x-factor, I don’t know who would win if he fought Kendall. Kalib was impressive in his preliminary fight but that was against a boxer with no ground skills and it was so long ago. One thing always bugged me about that fight though, when Kalib had Mike’s back why didn’t he just choke him out, why punch his skull for five minutes? Are his submission skills suspect? I guess we’ll see. I think he might be rusty like Ed was. Also, has anyone noticed Kalib is looking kind of soft? I know these guys can cut weight quick but I don’t know. I think either Ed or Kalib can take out Rory, Rory got lucky against Solomon with a sloppy kick but I think his luck has run out. As for the heavyweights, Ken’s team only has Jesse, the wrestler, who is lucky to be there. Mike Bipsing can probably submit him and Matt is a superior wrestler (if he recovers that is). Jesse might have a chance against Josh Haynes. Overall, at this point I would have to say Mike Bipsing is the favourite for lightheavyweights but we all know anything can happen.
As you say, that fight sucked. Mike didn’t look physically heated up enough nor psychologically ready to fight as he walked to the Octagon, and holy cow he wasn’t. He really seemed like a little kid who has had maybe one fight against another little kid who has to fight a bigger kid on the playground and is just hoping it’ll end soon. He was as bad as Mike Whitehead as far as complete lack of fighting spirit. Which come to think of it, Tatoo Mike seemed really un-confident even before the fight. Matt looked confident and composed, but we still have to see how he’ll respond when he gets into trouble.
As far as the semis, I’ll have to ponder a bit before I talk any trash there.
Re UFC 61, I finally saw Ken’s fight w/ Tito. Ken showed some balls but that doesn’t change the fact that he got mauled. Hard to see a 4 yrs older Ken doing much against Tito. He’s got a puncher’s chance but that’s about it.
Gracie should understand that strength is a huge factor in fighting. Going into a fight with the body of Mongomery Burns isn’t going to help.
No surprises in the semis. Although Ed dominated, I think he’s unprepared to fight someone as good as him who shows up to fight. He looks like he’s used to just somehow winning against inferior opposition and doesn’t have the ring presence you look for in a champ. He will however beat Kendall.
Michael beat Ross more easily than I thought. Ross also showed less “gladiatior” than he was talking. Michael will have no trouble with Josh, who comes to fight but has no ground game.
I kind of liked Ken before the show but don’t now. From what I’ve seen, he did just go through the motions with his fighters. Plus his smack talking makes me think even less of him. I can’t see him beating Tito. He’s 4 years older than last time and looked like crap against Rich Franklin.
Arlovski will beat Silvia again, although it will be by far the more interesting of the two big fights.
Edit: Oh, yeah – it sucked that Dana had Tito have to tell Matt he was out. Watching a guy find out his dream got crushed isn’t good drama, it’s bad reality TV and I think less of Dana for doing that.
…
Tito will KO Ken.
Andre will KO Tim
I think if Tim survives the first 5 seconds, he might be ok.
I’m looking forward to see if Tito can top his ring entrance from their first fight. (Where it looked like Tito had just ingested about 8 tubs of Power Drive or related substances).